Subject:
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Re: From Reason: "It's all bad news - Chaos in occupied Iraq"
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 7 Apr 2004 18:34:42 GMT
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Viewed:
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685 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Costello wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek wrote:
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http://www.reason.com/hod/nr032604.shtml
If this article is to be believed we are losing the peace quite
spectacularly.
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Here again the age old question, which is worse, stable but evil leaders, or
democracy and instability. Similar thing happened in the Philippines, Marcos
was corrupt and evil, but his regime was stable.
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...and, like SH, Marcos was supported by Washington.
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I’ve always thought that this was a silly criticism, true twenty years ago,
during the Iran/Iraq war we supported Hussein as the lesser of two evils, you
act as if we furnished his palace and rolled out the red carpet. We often have
dealings with foreign leaders with whom we disagree, I really don’t see the
point.
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As soon as he was removed chaos
ensued. Now many years later, they are better off, it just took a while.
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Forgive me, but I don’t remember the Philippines being invaded as part of an
illegal and immoral war to remove Marcos?
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First off the action in Iraq was no more illegal than any military action we
have taken since WWII, including Kennedy’s Vietnam or Truman’s Korea. I
personally believe that this is the most moral war we have been involved in. In
a post 9/11 world the US president needs to adequately deal with all threats. He
cannot simply bury his head in the sand and hope that no further innocent
American lives will be lost to terrorists.
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We are talking about a country that is tribal and brutal.
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It has been part of the occupation plan to fragment the population (divide
and conquer)... Bush sees tribalism as a benefit!
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Wow, now that is spin, encouraging Iraqi’s to rise up against their oppressor is
called divide and conquer.
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A country where
regional religious leaders run gang style groups who are not afraid of
lethal violence.
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Is Bush afraid to use “lethal violence”? Over 10,000 civilians have now been
killed; the deatils of around 700 may be found
here. At the start of the week he
deployed helicopter gunships in an urban area!
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I heard a radio interview with the creators of Iraqbodycount.net, they are a
clearly partisan group, whose research methods are suspect at best. Basically
they look at all news sources for any mention of civilian casualties. They make
no attempt to verify the numbers, nor to ensure that they are not double or
triple counting the same casualties. They are simply morbid hearse chasers,
using the event of accidental collateral damage to further their cause, truly
despicable.
Secondly civilian casualties are difficult to avoid when armament is hidden in
hospitals and school houses; also a challenge when men who profess a reverence
for a religion hide in a mosque and shoot at soldiers from it’s windows.
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Also a country whose leaders tell them that cutting themselves with
sabers and beating themselves with chains is a form of religious expression.
Not the easiest group to assist into the 21st century.
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Some of these things are a matter of culture. I’m sure they find the US porn
industry just as offensive.
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Agreed, although if they find US porn offensive, they would flip their lids at
some of that European stuff, our porn is relatively mild.
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Now some Iraqis are saying that they were better off under Hussein, which is
truly no surprise as several freed blacks in this country felt more secure
as slaves. A key fact that is overlooked here however, at least these Iraqis
now have the right to complain about the state of affairs, with out fear of
serious repercussion.
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lol That is not quite true. The current Shia uprising started when Bush shut
down a newspaper he did not approve of! FACT: Bush is to blame for the
current uprising.
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This uprising did not start with the shut down of the newspaper, although that
did escalate it. I also do not believe that this uprising is completely Shia,
there have been several Syrians found among the combatants. Also someone else,
either Iranian or Syrian is likely financing this whole operation.
Look I am not a blind Bush kool aid drinking follower, and I do not share his
optimism about the success of democracy in the middle east. It is really hard to
force a group of people accept freedom, actually a dichotomy in terms. I
supported this war because I agree with Bush, Blair, and all of the UN security
council that Iraq posed a threat, and after 9/11 the United States can no longer
afford to take any threat lightly.
Scott C.
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