Subject:
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Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:04:26 GMT
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Viewed:
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5701 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, James Brown writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Koudys writes:
> > And don't make the mistake of saying that evolution is science. Science is
> > based on what can be shown today--evolution happened a long time ago.
>
> <...>
>
> > And don't try to teach evolution as science. Science, either biology,
> > chemistry, and physics in high school, doesn't have to have *either* theory
> > taught at all for the children to succeed in these classes. My
> > understanding of a weight falling 9.8 m/s^2 doesn't need either theory.
> > Saying that 2H2 + O2 = H20 + energy certainly doesn't need it, and the
> > concept of photosynthesis certainly doesn't need either. High school is no
> > place for either of these theories to be taught.
>
> <...>
>
> > It is my opinion, true. Just as it is my opinion that evolution has less to
> > do with science as it does in forcing a theory of why God doesn't exist on
> > the public masses.
>
> Dave, I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding about what
> evolutionary theory is. I would encourage you to step back from the
> evolution:creation debate, and try and look at the theory of evolution from
> within a scientific framework. The theory of evolution has nothing
> whatsoever to do with the presence or absence of God (or god or gods or
> Yggdrasil's), and if it has been shown to you thusly, it's been misrepresented.
>
> thanks,
>
> James
Now this is refreshing--'The theory of Evolution' and saying that it has
nothing to do with the plausibility of God.
For the record, I believe the world to be millions of years old. I believe
the universe to be even older. I believe that there was this dust 'n
energy, and it formed into spirals, and the amount of dust coming together
would determine whether it became a sun or planets or remain dust (they say
Jupiter is a failed sun) I don't know all the specific names of such
happenings, but I have seen some awesome computer generated videos of what
probably happened.
I also believe that the galaxy, (nay the universe probably) is expanding,
and spreading away, and that also accounts for entropy (bigger space, same
amount of mass = less energy)
I also believe that this planet is not alone in the universe, that there are
galaxies and such far older than ours, and some far younger than ours. I
love the hubble pictures! I always read the science section of weekend
papers and am happy to see that they're finding planets *gasp* around other
suns. I love it!
I personally believe that this planet on which we live is *very* old. I once
watched a cave expedition way deep under the earth and they were following
this narrow chasm carved by water thru many strata of rock, and they had to
climb over part of a whale backbone! The entire whale skeleton was encased
in rock hundreds of feet below the surface of the planet! but for this
underground water ditch, eroding this 3 foot path thru the layers of rock,
no one would have ever known it was there.
I have no problem, even, with the *concept* that millions of years ago there
was no organisms, and for whatever reason (lightning, whatever) a few amino
acids came together and started the processes of life, and even the concept
that that microscopic pre-bacteria organisms evolved into all life on this
planet. It is a genetic theory that all humankind spawned from one first
woman. I think that's a good idea of how we came to be.
My issue, reiterated and restated and how I got into this debate, was the
notion that the scientific theory of evolution is that much better than any
other way of understanding why we are here and how we came to be.
For me, science can follow the 'matter' trail, can predict what happens in
the material world and seems to fit the known quantifiable facts, but its
the unquantifiable that I'm taking exception to, as in 'if it can't be seen
in science' it either does not exist or is not important to the betterment
of how we know the world.
As a *Christian* I believe that God started this mess and maintains it.
What He does is not quantifiable, because it's incomprehensible to finite
persons such as ourselves.
So I'll take science until it says that God can't exist, and what I get from
some portions of this debate that not only does He not exist, but those that
believe in Him are somehow lesser because of their belief.
That pretty much sums it up for me.
Dave
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Message has 3 Replies:
 | | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
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| (...) To clear up after reading my post and realizing that I didn't complete this thought--I was thanking James for his well worded response. It was shown to me thusly (trashing God) in parts of this debate and I appreciate his efforts to clear it (...) (22 years ago, 11-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
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| (...) But no one said that about evolution. I don't even thing that anyone asserted that about science. I happen to not believe in any kind god-stuff, but that has nothing to do with the topic. Even if I did, it would still be clear that evolution (...) (22 years ago, 11-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
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| (...) Well, people have been saying that all along!!!! What took you so long? Science in general has nothing to say about faith based beliefs other than "they are outside the purview of science". You can't use science to prove or disprove them. But (...) (22 years ago, 12-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
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| (...) <...> (...) <...> (...) Dave, I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding about what evolutionary theory is. I would encourage you to step back from the evolution:creation debate, and try and look at the theory of evolution from within a (...) (22 years ago, 11-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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