Subject:
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Re: Hiroshima-Was It Necessary?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 17 Oct 2001 15:23:44 GMT
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Viewed:
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555 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> Let's not blur the issue here. What was cowardly about the Sept 11 terrorism
> was that it took no courage to hijack civilian aircraft during peacetime and
> steer helpless civilian passengers into buildings. That's hardly the same as
> the US dropping bombs during war on a nation that had declared war on the US.
Yes, let's not blur the issue-- what part does being cowardly have in being
a terrorist? Let's say they flew their own planes into our buildings. No
longer a terrorist action? I don't think whether they/we were cowardly or
not is really relevant at all.
> > It's also easy to use phrases like "wartime solutions". Has not bin Laden
> > declared war on the US (http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/ladin.htm)?
>
> You're stating, in effect, that if I declare war on New Jersey, it is morally
> acceptable for me to kill thousands of innocent New Jersey residents.
Let's also not blur this issue. Does terrorism by definition need to be
morrally inacceptable? I don't think so. Morality doesn't really play a
part, as far as I'm concerned. It can still be moral, yet terrorist. But
then again, that's me being a moral relativist. Would it be moral for you to
"kill thousands of innocent [so what if they're innocent? another useless
point?] New Jersey residents"? Sure-- assuming you really believe it's
moral. But I'd still call it a terrorist act.
> Whether
> or not bin Laden has declared war on us, we had not, as of the 11th, entered
> into war with him. Japan, in 1941, declared war on us, and we in turn
> responded to that declaration.
And haven't we been at war with bin Laden *anyway*? Hasn't he been on our #1
most wanted list for a while now? Haven't we merely been incapable of
retaliating due to political reasons?
> > I say again, whether or not it was a "solution", whether or not it was
> > "necessary", whether or not Japan (at the time) was as evil empire, the act
> > of dropping the bombs on civilian cities (knowing it would cause great death
> > and destruction, and with reports that the radiation would probably also
> > cause much more pain) was still terrorism.
>
> But you're still not answering the question.
Perhaps you could state the question? I thought it was "was the bombing
necessary?" With a side topic of "was it terrorism?" He answered the latter
at the very least, and implied an answer to the 1st-- IE that it was
unnecessary.
> Terrorism, in the sense that
> you're using it, becomes a blank check of a term, since you're allowing
> yourself to avoid moral judgments by invoking a buzzword.
>
> So I'll ask you plainly: do you feel that the Sept 11 suicide bombing, in
> which civilians (in a nation that was not at war) were used as missiles is
> morally equivalent to the death of civilians in a nation that had declared
> war on its enemy, during a time when Japan was certainly aware of the war?
See above. Terrorism has nothing to do with morality. In my book. While you
can have moral judgements of terrorism, terrorism is not necessarily tied to
one particular moral judgement.
DaveE
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Hiroshima-Was It Necessary?
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| (...) It would still be cowardly for them to fly their own planes into the buildings because they would be making an unprovoked attack against innocent and unsuspecting civilians on the civilians' home soil during a time when the home nation was at (...) (23 years ago, 17-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Hiroshima-Was It Necessary?
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| (...) Let's not blur the issue here. What was cowardly about the Sept 11 terrorism was that it took no courage to hijack civilian aircraft during peacetime and steer helpless civilian passengers into buildings. That's hardly the same as the US (...) (23 years ago, 17-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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