Subject:
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Re: Rolling Blackouts
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 4 Jun 2001 02:00:50 GMT
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Viewed:
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1409 times
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Larry Pieniazek wrote:
>
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Daniel Jassim writes:
> > I found a few cool pieces of information that seemed relevant to grazing,
> > beef cattle, etc. These facts also point out the environmental benefits of
> > being vegetarian:
>
> <snip>
>
> Thanks for those (pretty scary) factoids! They argue that the true cost of
> meat is a LOT higher than we are actually paying because the producers are
> - using subsidised grazing
> - using subsidized feed
> - not paying for the pollution they cause (water, air, etc.)
> - and worst... not paying the ecosystem destruction costs of third world
> clearcut grazing
there's an interesting project being run by PETA looking at these very
issues ( http://www.taxmeat.com/ ). I first looked at the site last
year and found it pretty interesting. Probabaly the only thing PETA has
ever done that I almost like.
> because we are in a mixed economy where a lot of the indirect costs never
> get assessed.
Larry, I think I understand what your saying here, but could flesh it
out a bit (for the record). Would Libertopia assess all the costs, or
at least do a better job at it? The political parties I'm most
associated with think their solutions to the world's problems will fix
everyhthing in some form or the other. Personally, I'm not for any one
party- I'm more in for a sense -vs- nonsense approach.
> Are you personally vegetarian Dan? I've tried it but I can't stick, I just
> love a good juicy steak... How did you cut over?
You didn't ask me, but I'm at some level of veganism. It's been at
least six years since I had any meat. It was kinda hard at first,
especially since I went vegan right before the Christmas holidays and my
parents had no idea what to do for me. I think the last non-vegan food
I partook in before the switch was pumpkin-flavored ice cream. (mmm
good!!!). Here's a list of some things that make the switch easier
(from personal experiance and observations of others).
- find a friend so you can keep tabs on each other.
- avoid eating out as much as possible (because of temptation or
falling into an old groove)
- try to make things from scratch
- start shopping at natural food stores (although some grocery stores
are becoming more accessible)
- get a good cookbook
I thought I had more, but I seem to be drawing a blank...
My reasons for going vegan were largely based on similar statistics to
what Daniel pointed out. I've never really had much to do with any
animal rights issues. I find it funny that most people always try that
approach when arguing with me over my dietary habits.
Honestly, I get cravings for steak pretty often. It's not the taste,
smell, or appearance that I miss, but rather the feeling of the little
bits of muscle fiber that get stuck inbetween my teeth. wierd. i
found that making something to eat with a little bit of A-1 can solve
that craving though.
Now only if someone would make vegan versions of the PA Dutch Brand
donuts that I grew up with... then I could stick with it forever. :)
In light of the statistics that Daniel pointed out, its interesting to
note that many ecologists, a group that is and should be concerned with
these issues have a relatively low frequency of vegetarians and an even
lower frequency of vegans. In my experiance, I'm chastised (1) more
from that group of peers than the 'general public' I only know of one
other vegetarian in my department (about 90-105 people total) and only a
few others in the field. Of course, there was a vegetarian meal option
on the registration form for the Ecological Society of America annual
meeting registration I filled out today, so maybe there is a significant
number of 'us'. At some point, I would like to conduct a study of the
'eco-friendliness of environmental professionals' compared to the
general public. The results would be pretty interesting, IMO.
-chris
1- all in good fun, of course (i hope...)
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: Rolling Blackouts
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| (...) Remember Libertopia isn't a "utopia" so isn't perfect. But ya, that's the idea. The thought is that strict liability with no dodging responsibility behind corporate shells would lead to a better assessment of costs. (...) Which parties are you (...) (23 years ago, 4-Jun-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: Rolling Blackouts
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| (...) I'll tell you something that would make it easier for me to move to a vegan diet. I'm in California right now, and spent the day in San Francisco. We ate a most incredible dinner at a Vegan restaurant called Millenniun. It was indescribably (...) (23 years ago, 4-Jun-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Rolling Blackouts
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| (...) <snip> Thanks for those (pretty scary) factoids! They argue that the true cost of meat is a LOT higher than we are actually paying because the producers are - using subsidised grazing - using subsidized feed - not paying for the pollution they (...) (23 years ago, 3-Jun-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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