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I've been working on a tiny robot brick that I've nicknamed the "picoscout".
The goal is to fit the key features of the Scout brick (the blue one) in a
package the size of a light sensor. The plan is to have one pigtail for
power, and 2 electrical pads on the top AND bottom for a total of 2 sensor
inputs (probably touch only) and 2 motor outputs. I haven't quite figured
out how to let you choose which builtin program to run, but it will probably
be a recessed button on the bottom that you hold down when you apply power.
Besides tiny robots (limited more by the size of the 9v-battery box)
possible applications include a slave module for an RCX (put it on a motor
output, apply power when you want a standard drive/bump/turn robot, turn it
off when one of the RCX's three sensors see something and act with 2
remaining motors) or a touch-switch limted motor that cycles back and forth
(panning a sensor, for example). I'm also hoping to write a neural net
based learning program which will let you hook up the IO to any robot and
have it figure out how to avoid hitting things while still moving.
Anyway, I've returned to lugnet.robotics after a long hiatus to find, well,
everyone else is on hiatus! The robotics forum isn't hopping like it once
was. So I'm wondering if I should be buying enough parts to be able to sell
picoscouts to other enthusiasts, or if I should stick to my current supply
(enough for the big one on the breadboard, plus 2 finished size, muaha!).
Would anyone want to buy one of these? I can't see making it a kit (much
fiddly soldering) and even greatly undervaluing my assembly time they'd have
to cost $40-50. And eBay tells me you can get a real scout (maybe even an
RCX) for that much now.
Personally I think LEGO should ditch the microscout and the new blinky
vehicle crap and make these (which in volume they could do for $5-10 tops)
and include them in every set with a motor.
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In lugnet.robotics, Ben Jackson writes:
[snip all]
Hey Ben -
Seen your name floating around lately, and when I saw this post decided to
check out your site. I remmeber you were like the second LEGO site I ran
into online, right after Paul Gyugyi's, back in summer of 1996!! WOW!
So, I checked, and you still have your raytracing page up there. Hasn't
changed much :-) (for those reading this: http://www.ben.com/LEGO/) Now I
remember discovering all the cool LEGO stuff online back in the day, waaay
before LUGNET came around. That was a long time ago!
-Tim
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In lugnet.robotics, Ben Jackson writes:
> I've been working on a tiny robot brick that I've nicknamed the "picoscout".
> The goal is to fit the key features of the Scout brick (the blue one) in a
> package the size of a light sensor. The plan is to have one pigtail for
> power, and 2 electrical pads on the top AND bottom for a total of 2 sensor
> inputs (probably touch only) and 2 motor outputs. I haven't quite figured
> out how to let you choose which builtin program to run, but it will probably
> be a recessed button on the bottom that you hold down when you apply power.
This sounds like an interesting idea. If you are looking for potential users
try the train groups. Allot of the train builders are trying various remote
control ideas for driving trains and operating track switches.
If I were thinking up a next generation brick I would move in the direction of
modularity. I woud try to come up with an external bus/power distribution
concept that would allow a smaller (possibly externally powered) CPU unit which
would have lots of memory and some way to connect it to other modules. The CPU
would have just a couple of buttons and leds and maybe an IR port. Modules
could include lcds, powered outputs, various sensors, and (here's a big one)
standard interface modules such as RS232, USB or ethernet. If you used a
standard bus you coul even hang disk off it. There are some micro drives that
could fit in a few bricks
Lester
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In lugnet.robotics, Lester Witter writes:
<snip>
> If I were thinking up a next generation brick I would move in the direction of
> modularity. I woud try to come up with an external bus/power distribution
> concept that would allow a smaller (possibly externally powered) CPU unit which
> would have lots of memory and some way to connect it to other modules. The CPU
> would have just a couple of buttons and leds and maybe an IR port. Modules
> could include lcds, powered outputs, various sensors, and (here's a big one)
> standard interface modules such as RS232, USB or ethernet. If you used a
> standard bus you coul even hang disk off it. There are some micro drives that
> could fit in a few bricks
>
> Lester
I thought this sort of system was actually being worked on by members of
LUGNET? I am sure there were several very long and very detailed discussions
not too long ago.
The "picoscout" sounds very cool to me. However, it sounds like there won't
be any sort of user programming capability allowed. This fact coupled with
the suggested price would make it a bit less attractive to me. Although it
would be cool to have a light sensor sized scout :)
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In lugnet.robotics, Ben Jackson writes:
> I've been working on a tiny robot brick that I've nicknamed the "picoscout".
> The goal is to fit the key features of the Scout brick (the blue one) in a
> package the size of a light sensor. The plan is to have one pigtail for
> power, and 2 electrical pads on the top AND bottom for a total of 2 sensor
> inputs (probably touch only) and 2 motor outputs. I haven't quite figured
> out how to let you choose which builtin program to run, but it will probably
> be a recessed button on the bottom that you hold down when you apply power.
>
> Besides tiny robots (limited more by the size of the 9v-battery box)
> possible applications include a slave module for an RCX (put it on a motor
> output, apply power when you want a standard drive/bump/turn robot, turn it
> off when one of the RCX's three sensors see something and act with 2
> remaining motors) or a touch-switch limted motor that cycles back and forth
> (panning a sensor, for example). I'm also hoping to write a neural net
> based learning program which will let you hook up the IO to any robot and
> have it figure out how to avoid hitting things while still moving.
>
> Anyway, I've returned to lugnet.robotics after a long hiatus to find, well,
> everyone else is on hiatus! The robotics forum isn't hopping like it once
> was. So I'm wondering if I should be buying enough parts to be able to sell
> picoscouts to other enthusiasts, or if I should stick to my current supply
> (enough for the big one on the breadboard, plus 2 finished size, muaha!).
> Would anyone want to buy one of these? I can't see making it a kit (much
> fiddly soldering) and even greatly undervaluing my assembly time they'd have
> to cost $40-50. And eBay tells me you can get a real scout (maybe even an
> RCX) for that much now.
>
> Personally I think LEGO should ditch the microscout and the new blinky
> vehicle crap and make these (which in volume they could do for $5-10 tops)
> and include them in every set with a motor.
This sounds really cool! Just to be able to pack all that functionality
into a brick that size would be very useful. I'd buy a couple from you for
sure.
I assume you'd have IR on the thing, so you could always use the remote or
commands from another brick to tell the picoscout which program to run
instead of trying to pack a pushbutton in there.
Would you support downloadable firmware? Otherwise I suppose you'd have to
burn in your own firmware in order to run byte code. How would one program
this thing?
- Chris.
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I'd be very interested indeed to buy a couple of those, assuming the price
is reasonable!
Bert
www.vandam.tk Artificial Intelligence and Machine Learning
> I've been working on a tiny robot brick that I've nicknamed the • "picoscout".
> The goal is to fit the key features of the Scout brick (the blue one) in a
> package the size of a light sensor. The plan is to have one pigtail for
> power, and 2 electrical pads on the top AND bottom for a total of 2 sensor
> inputs (probably touch only) and 2 motor outputs. I haven't quite figured
> out how to let you choose which builtin program to run, but it will • probably
> be a recessed button on the bottom that you hold down when you apply • power.
>
> Besides tiny robots (limited more by the size of the 9v-battery box)
> possible applications include a slave module for an RCX (put it on a motor
> output, apply power when you want a standard drive/bump/turn robot, turn • it
> off when one of the RCX's three sensors see something and act with 2
> remaining motors) or a touch-switch limted motor that cycles back and • forth
> (panning a sensor, for example). I'm also hoping to write a neural net
> based learning program which will let you hook up the IO to any robot and
> have it figure out how to avoid hitting things while still moving.
>
> Anyway, I've returned to lugnet.robotics after a long hiatus to find, • well,
> everyone else is on hiatus! The robotics forum isn't hopping like it once
> was. So I'm wondering if I should be buying enough parts to be able to • sell
> picoscouts to other enthusiasts, or if I should stick to my current supply
> (enough for the big one on the breadboard, plus 2 finished size, muaha!).
> Would anyone want to buy one of these? I can't see making it a kit (much
> fiddly soldering) and even greatly undervaluing my assembly time they'd • have
> to cost $40-50. And eBay tells me you can get a real scout (maybe even an
> RCX) for that much now.
>
> Personally I think LEGO should ditch the microscout and the new blinky
> vehicle crap and make these (which in volume they could do for $5-10 tops)
> and include them in every set with a motor.
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In an effort to not take 2+ years to get pictures from my camera to my
website, here's a brief photo update on the project:
http://www.ben.com/LEGO/rcx/picoscout/
Having mangled, er, adapted only my second 2x8 electrical plate to make it 4
individual 2x2 pads, I'm starting to think that the fabrication aspect of
making these bricks would drive me to drink. So proposing to sell them
might have been premature. :)
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It looks very interesting!
Maybe you could sell just the 'difficult' parts like the controller and the
interface and leave the rest up to the individual buyers.
Bert
www.vandam.tk Artificial Intelligence and Machine Learning
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ben Jackson" <ben@ben.com>
To: <lego-robotics@crynwr.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 12:49 AM
Subject: Re: Is there any interest in a tiny scout-like brick?
> In an effort to not take 2+ years to get pictures from my camera to my
> website, here's a brief photo update on the project:
> http://www.ben.com/LEGO/rcx/picoscout/
>
> Having mangled, er, adapted only my second 2x8 electrical plate to make it • 4
> individual 2x2 pads, I'm starting to think that the fabrication aspect of
> making these bricks would drive me to drink. So proposing to sell them
> might have been premature. :)
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In lugnet.robotics, Ben Jackson writes:
> In an effort to not take 2+ years to get pictures from my camera to my
> website, here's a brief photo update on the project:
> http://www.ben.com/LEGO/rcx/picoscout/
>
> Having mangled, er, adapted only my second 2x8 electrical plate to make it 4
> individual 2x2 pads, I'm starting to think that the fabrication aspect of
> making these bricks would drive me to drink. So proposing to sell them
> might have been premature. :)
As someone who is currently trying to bring a custom MindStorms sensor to
market, I understand how you feel. I have mangled my share of LEGO with the
old Dremel, only to hear that heart-wrenching crunch as I break a delicate
reed switch with too much pressure. I can assure you that it does get
easier with repetition.
I hope you'll at least consider putting together a kit with "some assembly
required" if you decide not to mangle your own bricks for a living.
- Chris.
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I finally got a web page for my Micro-Brick.
http://perso.freelug.org/legway/Robots/MicroBrick.html
When I say "mine"... I didn't make it, but it's one of the last things I got
from Hi-Technic, before they stopped making stuff.
Check it out, and tell me what you think.
Steve
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