Subject:
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Re: Will Libertopia cause the needy to get less?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 27 Nov 2000 19:31:51 GMT
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Viewed:
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349 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Frank Filz writes:
> One of the central arguments against libertarian principles is that
> there will be more poor starving folks. I assert that this will not be
> the case.
>
> It is to my benefit that my neighbor isn't starving and desperate. If he
> is, he is likely to rob me. If he busts my car window to get a stereo
> which he sells to a pawn shop, something like $100 has been wasted, all
> to transfer about $100 worth of wealth from me to other folks. So in the
> end, I'd ultimately rather just give the fellow a hundred bucks. Of
> course, ideally, I'd like to give him that hundred bucks using a system
> which encouraged him to use it not just to feed his wants, but to also
> make himself more valuable to society.
Here's where I have a big problem with that view. Your reasoning behind
wanting to give your next door neighbor the $100 seems solely based on the
fact that if you don't, he has the potential to cause more damage to you.
Hence, it seems to me that you're building up a society based on a threat.
Why should I give him money? Cuz if I don't, he'll cost me more, or beat me
up, or kill me, or whatever.
Hence, if this is the real reason, then we have to evaluate the threat of
each person individually. If my next door neighbor is a weightlifting,
intelligent, suspicious, self-centered, jealous jerk, I should give him more
money than my other neighbor who's a selfless, dumb weakling, because the
1st guy poses more of a threat to me and society at large.
The one saving grace in the argument is perhaps in the "system which
encourage[s] him to use it not just to feed his wants, but to also make
himself more valuable to society". However, I'm not entirely sure what you
mean there-- it could be you just mean that he's only allowed to spend the
money in some 'positive' way, in which case, I still have a phenomenal moral
problem with the system you're proposing, since giving him the money is
based on threats, not:
A. moral character
B. positive accomplishments
C. intellect
D. genuine need
or any one of a bunch of things I would deem more valid of a reason other
than 'threat potential'. But if you mean something else, I dunno...
> Of course there's even more waste when this poor starving neighbor busts
> my window. If he gets caught, in our current system, we're going to
> waste $1000s of resources to "punish" him, and likely, he'll get tossed
> in prison where it will certainly appear that he is living better, but
> in the meantime, whatever self respect and drive for success he had is
> probably even further trampled, or worse twisted (so that next time,
> instead of busting my car window he kills me).
I certainly agree that our system of government has the ability to (and
does) foster this sort of consequence. I think the idea behind it is of
course that these "wrong-doers" will see the error of their ways and not do
it again upon their release, but as evidenced in society, I don't think it
works very well; even though I agree with its principles.
Just some thoughts,
DaveE
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Will Libertopia cause the needy to get less?
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| (...) <snip> (...) I had a feeling I had incompletely communicated my stance. I do think that altruistic charity based on qualities like you list above is the most effective. My point is more that one needs to look at the entire system and examine (...) (24 years ago, 27-Nov-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Will Libertopia cause the needy to get less?
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| One of the central arguments against libertarian principles is that there will be more poor starving folks. I assert that this will not be the case. It is to my benefit that my neighbor isn't starving and desperate. If he is, he is likely to rob me. (...) (24 years ago, 27-Nov-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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