Subject:
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Re: Danish cartoons outrage some Moslem groups and nations
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Sun, 5 Feb 2006 20:33:32 GMT
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Viewed:
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1704 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Timothy Gould wrote:
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--SNIP--
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Protests in London call for terrorist strikes against Europe, threaten those
who insult Islam with execution, and generally reject liberal democracy.
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--SNIP--
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Danish Embassy in Lebanon and Syria are attacked by protestors and set on
fire.
Christian groups haven’t done these sorts of things in a long time.
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Apart from on Bosnia, and Liberia and the other places where they have. Sure
we don’t have the pretty pictures of it but that’s because, according to the
Western media, those people don’t count.
And that’s not to mention the doctor killers and the Oklahoma bombing and
other activities in the US. And let’s not restrict ourselves to Christians.
What about the Hindu mosque burnings in India and the Jewish settlers in
Israel.
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I don’t mean to suggest any society is free of extremists and crazies.
Christianity has been responsible for some of the most horrendous acts in
history - cruel, horrible actions that seem devoid of purpose or humanity. Nor
am I trying to say that only Islam has these extremists.
But theres a difference between some extremists committing violence and a crowd
of 15,000 attacking an embassy because a government won’t silence and punish a
newspaper for exercising their right to satire. That is what sets this a part
from every other act of violence you listed: the totally surreal justification
for it.
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As much
as I don’t like the idea of ‘culture war’ - I don’t know how to respond to
this. The Muslim world is going to town on a few cartoons mocking a
religious/historical figure and, as I’ve read on a few blogs, a reaction
that was noticably absent in their reaction to terrorism and violence.
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What noticeably absent response? The Muslim council of Britain spoke very
loudly and clearly against terror. Similarly in Australia and the US AFAIK.
Perhaps you mean the governments in the Middle East? Although I’m pretty sure
quite a few of them denounced terror too.
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Not as loudly or as forcably. I have yet to see a major protest of Muslims in
the West or Mid East emphasizing Islam’s peaceful, tolerant side.
Perhaps I missed something then.
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And sure,
these are the extremists and all extremists are bad. I’m just left with the
feeling that extremism is much more prevalent than anyone ever thought - I’m
left with the feel that extremism is the culture.
-Lenny
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Perhaps the extremism has been made more prevalent. When people are poor,
ignorant and oppressed and foreign powers act as though their interests are
unimportant (and if I was them, I wouldn’t consider having my country bombed
into freedom to be in my own interests) I’m not surprised they turn to people
who promise them salvation. Considering the depth of Christian fundamentalism
in the wealthy, relatively educated and free US I’m almost surprised there
isn’t more extremism.
Tim
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When people are poor, ignorant, and oppressed, violence is not the answer.
Martin Luther King jr and Mohandas Gandhi have proven that. As much as their
situation is hellish, it never gives them the right to retaliate. Not to
mention, the governments of Syria, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and Libya
aren’t poor or oppressed
But the issue here isn’t Islamic violence versus Christian, Jewish, Hindu or
Buddhist violence - it is about free speech. These riots weren’t over poor job
oppurtunities, Israeli settlements, or foreign oppression. These riots are over
satirical cartoons, and the Danish government’s refusal to punish the paper. My
problem is about the seemingly widespread extremist reaction against democracy
and freedom.
This picture emphasizes the issue perfectly:
That man is living in London - so he doesn’t have the right to claim being
oppressed or ignorant - England has social liberties and free libraries. And he
is rejecting the fundamental assumption of Western society: the man has an
inalienable right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
-Lenny
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