Subject:
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Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:42:11 GMT
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Viewed:
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587 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Mike Petrucelli wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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Every country and US State that has enacted gun control laws has not had
any noticable difference in gun crimes. The only thing they have succeded
in doing is disarming law abiding citizens.
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From this very thread:
http://news.lugnet.com/off-topic/debate/?n=21740
“Handgun crime is lower now (in Scotland) than 10 years ago (they were
“banned” in 97).”
Scott A
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Also from that same post.
“I think overall gun crime is rising (perhaps we should ban all guns?), but
I doubt you’ll find data that suggest increased gun ownership in the UK
would improve things?”
Well guess what, the gun crime rate in the U.S. is lower than it was 10
years ago.
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Let’s assume that’s true. Look back to 10-15 years ago; there were large
fluctuations in gun crime in the USA caused by the “shall-issue” laws. So
your comparison with Bonnie Scotland is bogus.
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(The U.S. has always had a higher crime that the U.K. regardless of gun
law status) So once again, there is no noticable difference to gun crime as
a result of gun laws.
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Are you blind? Read what I said again:
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Did you read what you wrote?
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“Handgun crime is lower now (in Scotland) than 10 years ago (they were
“banned” in 97).”
This refers to all gun crime:
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So making Hadguns illegal has only caused criminals to use other guns. (What a
surprise.) Have you ever heard of the Black Market. Criminals will always have
guns.
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“I think overall gun crime is rising (perhaps we should ban all guns?), but I
doubt you’ll find data that suggest increased gun ownership in the UK would
improve things?”
... and it’s not just Scotland:
http://www.converge.org.nz/pma/gunaus.htm
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Yeah and I can find a dozen sites with the oppisite data. The only conclusion we
can draw is that both sides are using only the data that supports their
respective arguments and ignoring anything to the contrary. Therefore logically
there is no correlation between gun laws and the crime rate.
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“Sharp Drop in Gun Crime Follows Tough Australian Firearm Laws”
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The only thing that is accomplished is disarming law
abiding citizens. Now why would the government want to disarm law abiding
citizens? Gun Control is about Control not Guns.
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I fear you are mixing “Gun Control” with the “Patriot Act”. ;)
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I think you are failing to realize that they are the exact same type of
abomination. So long as “Gun Control” does not exist the “Patriot Act” can not
be enforced. To be perfectly honest I don’t care what you do in Scottland. If
you want to give up your ability to defend yourself from government corruption
that is your buisness. Anyone that tries to take away my constitutionally
protected fundamental rights better find a cure for brain lead first. You may
find it scary/disturbing/crazy/insane or whatever that I have no moral problem
with killing or risk dying to protect freedom, but that is my position. Even if
you were able to convince me that Gun Control reduces crime I would still see it
as telling me I should chop off my legs to save one of my little fingers. I just
don’t think that is going to happen.
-Mike Petrucelli
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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| (...) That's not quite right. Logically, data cannot be used selectively to demonstrate the efficacy of gun control laws. However, it does not logically follow, therefore, that no correlation exists between gun control and gun crime. I happen to (...) (21 years ago, 12-Sep-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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| (...) Let's assume that's true. Look back to 10-15 years ago; there were large fluctuations in gun crime in the USA caused by the "shall-issue" laws. So your comparison with Bonnie Scotland is bogus. (...) Are you blind? Read what I said again: (...) (21 years ago, 11-Sep-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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