Subject:
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Re: Rights to free goods? (was Re: What happened?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Fri, 2 Jul 1999 19:59:11 GMT
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Viewed:
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1154 times
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Frank Filz wrote in message <377A8667.334E@mindspring.com>...
> Ed Jones wrote:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Frank Filz writes:
> > > I think that in a perfect liberatopia, all three of these people would
> > > have no problem getting the care they need, through charity.
> > So you are saying that these people have the right to the care that they • need.
>
> No.
No, he did not say that. Its funny how people who like to take other
people's property also like to take other people's words and misuse them.
> > Isn't charity the giving of free goods?
>
> Yes and no.
Frank is catching on quick, but I do not see how the answer is yes and
no. PLMK. Anyway, I don't think the giving of free goods exist. There are
goods (none of which are free because some one must produce them, always at
a cost). Charity is the giving of goods - theft is the taking of goods.
Either given freely or taken by force, there is no other way goods can be
transferred. Only one way is right, or just, or acceptable to a person
whose morals are not flawed.
> > Are you saying that these people have
> > a right to free goods?
>
> No. There is no right to charity. A charity may feel a moral obligation
> to help, but that moral obligation is something between them and their
> benefactors. A charity will set conditions under which it provides goods
> and services. Some charities will have less stringent conditions, others
> will have more stringent conditions. The benefactors are free to chose
> the charity whose conditions they agree with. In a free market,
> charities will arise which serve the interests of the benefactors.
>
> Our government is actually largely a charity, but unfortuanately we
> don't get to decide how much to contribute, so there is no market to
> guide the government into supporting those charitable services that the
> people really want to support.
>
> Libertarianism is being portrayed as a cold uncaring society. What I
> read from Larry's posts is not a cold uncaring society. I see a society
> which will make the best world for as many people as are willing to
> participate to the best of their ability in that society. And yes, that
> society will be cold and uncaring to certain people. So is our current
> society (ask the various refugee groups who we haven't gone in and
> stomped their oppressors for one example).
That is one of the virtues of selfishness (thats a pun for any one who
missed it) - its more of a trait. All of us who hold selfishness as a
virtue are seen as cold and uncaring, when that really is untrue. I am
selfish (you have to love your self) and the higher society rises,
inevitably the higher I can. Our current society is, in fact, much more
cold and uncaring than the libertopia these guys are wishing for. If
society becomes a better place for the people at the top, it also becomes a
better place for those in between and at the bottom. Just compare the
luxuries of wealth now to 100 years ago, and do the same for the
impoverished now and 100 years ago - all have escalated. The gap may be
larger, but EVERYONE is better off now. Of course life is what you make of
it, if you choose to make nothing of it, you will obtain your goal,
regardless of how well society manages.
> --
> Frank Filz
>
> -----------------------------
> Work: mailto:ffilz@us.ibm.com
> Home: mailto:ffilz@mindspring.com
--
Have fun!
John
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