Subject:
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Re: Bummer of the Week: LEGO Made in China
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Thu, 6 Sep 2001 23:47:58 GMT
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Viewed:
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1601 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Chris Leach writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Bruce Schlickbernd writes:
> >
> > > > What I really want to know is where the heck was Russia during all this
> > > > Nazi stuff? ;^)
> >
> > > Russia and Germany were engaged in the greatest land battle in the history
> > > of the planet. The scope and devastation of it was truly appalling - it's
> > > what ground Germany up. Of course, neither of those two sides was out to
> > > "save" Europe, and Stalin would have have been the greatest monster of all
> > > time if not for Hitler.
> >
> > Yeah, I'm not a big Stalin fan in any case, but it seems likely that
> > goodly chunk of my ancestry was wiped out by his antics in the Ukraine.
> > I hoped the ;^) would be a tip off, but, balancing that against my
> > admission of ignorance, I can see why you thought my question was sincere!
> > At this point I'm simply parroting what I overheard in a conversation
> > between two coworkers, but they expressed a view that the tide of WWII might
> > have gone differently if the winter had been less severe.
General Winter, the finest leader of the Russian Army!
Well, him and that Zhukov chap. ;)
> Keep this in mind....if Hitler had let his generals run the war they would
> have won it.They did not want to fight the U.S. OR the U.S.S.R. Also without
> Hitlers interference the jet plane would have been put into production alot
> sooner and would have wiped our bombers/fighters from the sky and without
> air support our troops would have had made little difference.
If Hitler's generals had run the war, Hitler couldn't have
been Hitler. What happened was as much doctrine as it was
individuals--it's like any counterfactual, the material
possibilities aren't necessarily the same as the ideological
ones.
BTW, The idea that Hitler's interference somehow screwed up the
jet project is really untrue. The Me-262 (and the He-280
before it) had serious airframe issues that took until 1944
to sort out. What's more, the Jumo 004 engines weren't ready
until then anyways. Hitler was an annoyance, but it was the
technical issues that really delayed the arrival of operational
jet fighters. Even with them operational, the average service
life of an engine was only 10 hours' flying--after that they
tended to overheat and catch fire or eat themselves. (A really
nasty tendency...catch a bit of fan blade in the head there,
mister pilot?) All warring nations had these troubles, and all
had jet aircraft on the drawing board as early as 1942.
Even with the Me-262 in the air, a lot of US and British pilots
could shoot them down--even when there were talented pilots at
the jet's controls--because of their superior maneuverability.
The real value of the 262 was that it could scream out of nowhere,
make a pass, and then vanish, turn around safely, and make another.
Luftwaffe pilots were flying them in dogfights, which was really
really stupid.
But Hitler wanted that plane. True, he did envision it first as
a bomber, but if he could have had his Bomber 262 in 1942, he
would have loved it.
best
LFB
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Bummer of the Week: LEGO Made in China
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| (...) LFB Germany was working on the 262 eaaly in the war ..then Hitler told them i want a bomber which delayed work on the fighter(and the fixing of problems)this fact has been stated many times in documentaries that i seen on THC/A&E. (...) (23 years ago, 7-Sep-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Bummer of the Week: LEGO Made in China
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| (...) Keep this in mind....if Hitler had let his generals run the war they would have won it.They did not want to fight the U.S. OR the U.S.S.R. Also without Hitlers interference the jet plane would have been put into production alot sooner and (...) (23 years ago, 6-Sep-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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