Subject:
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Re: Libertarian SPAM (Propaganda)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:43:53 GMT
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Viewed:
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1185 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Bruce Schlickbernd writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Bruce Schlickbernd writes:
> > > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> But on a greater level, you feel disenfranchised because the political
> philosophy you support can't muster the votes to get anywhere.
That's not exactly true. It may not be mustering votes, but like I said, it
doesn't have to win elections, per se. Peace and freedom ARE winning. So I
can feel disenfranchised for my own reasons.
> > If this isn't micromeddling in how a business conducts its affairs then I
> > don't know what it is.
>
> I was refering to cases that prevent racism and you are refering to cases
> that require racism. If you have a beef against the former, you need to
> address that with examples that apply, not ones that are the exact opposite.
Preventing racism and requiring it are both meddling.
> > Did you? Haven't denied that businesses, given the chance,
> > will play a game that *allows* for them to get unfair advantage in such a
> > way that they *do* get unfair advantage. I prefer to change the game rules
> > so that no one business can get unfair advantage written into law.
>
> I don't see how fair or unfair advantage relates to racism in relation to
> the Jim Crow laws or current discrimination cases.
Suppose I wanted to start a bus line that let people sit where they would.
If the state government enforces laws that prevent me from doing so, and
thus securing competitive advantage in the market I choose to serve over a
bus line that requires segregation, is not that an unfair barrier to entry?
If, further, armed thugs come by and torch my bus garage and the state denys
me protection and refuses to prosecute the arsonists, is that not an unfair
barrier to entry?
The bus monopoly would have fell without the need for antidiscrimination
laws if the laws requiring discrimination were struck down and if the
lawkeepers did their job or suffered the personal consequences of not doing so.
> > The government doesn't discriminate, it oppresses lots of different groups.
> > Just in different ways. Welfare as it currently is constructed is a
> > particularly insidious form of oppression, as you highlighted.
>
> But it's interesting to note that those who oppose welfare the most
> (Republicans) are also the ones who don't want it to change.
Ya, funny that.
> > You still need to show that allowing free association and choosing who to do
> > business with is in and of itself unjust or that it is likely to lead to
> > unrest.
>
>
> I already showed it: the civil rights movement.
Don't see it, sorry.
> No, don't try and palm it
> off as something Jim Crow laws foisted onto businesses - those business
> interests behind the Jim Crow laws were effectively trying to achieve
> exactly what you are talking about. If you don't understand this, I can
> only say it illustrates the reason why the Libertarian Party is mostly white
> males.
And I can only say that your understanding (of what a free market actually
is) is flawed and we should agree to disagree.
++Lar
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Libertarian SPAM (Propaganda)
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| (...) I pointed out the real difference between your two examples - you consistently refuse to address it. (...) The scenario in regards to Jim Crow is the state government gave you an excuse to allow the segregated busing you wanted (you not being (...) (23 years ago, 15-Jun-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Libertarian SPAM (Propaganda)
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| (...) Well no wonder you feel disenfranchised - the American people rejected Dubya both on a majority and plurality base, and he's still the president. :-( But on a greater level, you feel disenfranchised because the political philosophy you support (...) (23 years ago, 15-Jun-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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