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Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
I'll just free associate about the game...
First off, as has been mentioned before, this was absolutely the best
game we have played so far. Some contributions to this were:
- We were able to setup Friday night.
- Almost all of the participants were able to play the whole game.
- I was somewhat better rested, and at least had Friday to recover from
hectic travel.
- I really simplified island play. Instead of having major scenario
islands, most islands just had some buried treasure, or a stranded
pirate or two or three. The most time spent on any island was about 5
turns (3 separate islands). None of those islands required heavy
interaction with me.
- With more treasure to be had on the islands, several folks made it
into port to sell captured ships and treasure and buy more gear or
better ships.
Some things which may not have gone so well:
- The only larger ships were three class 2 ships I brought. We were
severely lacking when Scott Quirk (?) got a big treasure haul.
- I probably made gems a little too valuable (they were word 1d6x10
gold, if a 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x100 gold, and if yet
another 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x200 gold).
- I had talked about using a deck of cards for island contents, I think
this would be a good idea.
- We didn't have enough range sticks. A combination of the K-8 not being
out Friday, and the sparseness of it meant we had to improvise a bit. I
am thinking about having some 2x4s engraved with numbers to use for
making some range sticks.
- We were almost short of island material, though Lindsay came up with a
couple clever ways to use all the palm tree bits Chris had brought
amongst which was only a single palm tree fork. Duplo 2x2 bricks
actually worked out to make nice little rocks (which tended to not be
very interesting, though one chain made a handy way for some pirates to
swim from one island to the next, and reduce the chance of attracting
sharks).
- NPC ships are just a pain, I suspect this is one reason Steve runs
only battle games now. I put Lindsay in charge of one of the merchants
at one point. Actually, I think neither merchant really did much (except
the 2nd one got a good shot on Larry), though the 2nd one may have been
captured near the end (the 1st got off almost unscathed, despite sailing
right at Shiri...). The Islander catamaran wasn't too much of a pain to
run because it didn't last long.
- I needed to think a bit about the islands which were a little more
interesting. The shrine was pretty easy when Kai Brodersen blew up the
statue's head with a cannon ball (each pirate who spent a turn searching
found 1d6 gold, with a 6 meaning a gem instead). On one large island,
Lindsay stumbled into an alligator. On another, Larry found some silver
worth mining (unfortunately, his ship and captain were killed and
someone else [durn, forgot the name] captured the silver). On a third,
some islanders were present, and put up a bit of a fight (and launched a
catamaran which proceeded to nearly sweep Larry's new ship of crew,
fortunately he was right next to an island populated by three stranded
crew, and then headed to Strawberry Island to collect some giant
strawberries and some more crew).
I'm thinking that most islands should be small (the 16x16 printed
islands work great, but a few built up islands like the shrine or
Strawberry Island [built from about 10 Duplo bricks - this provided
cover for Larry once] would be nice also). The larger islands are harder
to deal with since they can take several turns to explore. The island we
used as a pirate base turned out to also provide some separation of the
ocean which worked well.
When Scott realized he wasn't going to be able to crew all the ships he
had to buy to spend his money, he negotiated with Shiri and (?) who were
not in the best of shape. They helped crew his ships and the combined
armada stood a good chance of sweeping the ocean had we more time. Of
course Chris Weeks and Larry had joined in common cause, and Kai was
potentially going to join them, which would have made it a close fight
(but still with the advantage to Scott's fleet).
Some of the notable moments:
The time Kai knocked his ship over and sent two crew flying. Followed
shortly by knocking the top of the mast off.
Blowing up the statues head.
Lindsay and (?) capturing one ship, starting to tow it home, and then
the other player back stabbing Lindsay just as Scott's fleet was about
to set sail.
The time two ships both destroyed each other's cannon (I think this was
Larry and Shiri).
Frank
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In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
> the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
> I'll just free associate about the game...
<beaucoup de snippage...> :)
It looked like Larry didn't have a lot of luck this year... ;)
The game looked very fun from what I saw of it. I was tempted to join but
was "rebuffed" when I was told that I couldn't use Imperials or use Islanders.
I am not really a big fan of using "scurvy knaves" ... maybe next year
I can help Frank with controlling a NPC ship or the island of natives... :)
Ben
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In lugnet.events.brickfest, Benjamin Medinets writes:
> In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> > Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
> > the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
> > I'll just free associate about the game...
>
> <beaucoup de snippage...> :)
>
> It looked like Larry didn't have a lot of luck this year... ;)
That would be putting it mildly!
> The game looked very fun from what I saw of it. I was tempted to join but
> was "rebuffed" when I was told that I couldn't use Imperials or use Islanders.
I was unaware that you asked to use imperials. I played imperials last year
(who promptly "went bad")...
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In lugnet.fun.gaming, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> In lugnet.events.brickfest, Benjamin Medinets writes:
> > In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> > > Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
> > > the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
> > > I'll just free associate about the game...
> >
> > <beaucoup de snippage...> :)
> >
> > It looked like Larry didn't have a lot of luck this year... ;)
>
> That would be putting it mildly!
>
> > The game looked very fun from what I saw of it. I was tempted to join but
> > was "rebuffed" when I was told that I couldn't use Imperials or use Islanders.
>
> I was unaware that you asked to use imperials. I played imperials last year
> (who promptly "went bad")...
really....that was interesting. I asked Frank when he was taking a bit of
time for you guys to plot your moves....
I should have used the key words .... "went bad" I guess.... ;)
Ben
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Benjamin Medinets wrote:
>
> In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> > Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
> > the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
> > I'll just free associate about the game...
>
> <beaucoup de snippage...> :)
>
> It looked like Larry didn't have a lot of luck this year... ;)
>
> The game looked very fun from what I saw of it. I was tempted to join but
> was "rebuffed" when I was told that I couldn't use Imperials or use Islanders.
>
> I am not really a big fan of using "scurvy knaves" ... maybe next year
> I can help Frank with controlling a NPC ship or the island of natives... :)
I'm sorry to have rebuffed you. I have been trying to figure out just
how to use non-pirates in the game. There needs to be some additional
background work done. I am also afraid that such additional background
detail may be an additional load on an already overloaded GM.
This years game was the first I didn't feel overwhelmed as a single GM,
since I am finally comfortable with the rules, many of the other players
are also comfortable, and I greatly simplified the island interaction.
One problem is coming up with interesting goals for non-pirates which
are reasonably balanced. Clearly, the ships can be balanced. I came up
with a quick and dirty way to run the islander catamaran which basically
made it equivalent to a cutter, though a different damage table would
give it more flavor. But what is the goal of islanders? They aren't
going to capture pirate ships and take them in to port to sell them. One
idea I have is that for each European (pirate or imperial) ship
captured, the islander captain would gain more followers and more
islander boats.
I would love to have merchants be a viable playing position, but I'm
just not sure how to set up the economic rules to work. Traditionally
also, the merchants have been a way to capture a bigger ship, so how
would one play that into the equation? On the other hand, someone
clearly functioning as a co-GM could easily handle merchant ships. A
simple table or card drawing system could determine where a new merchant
enters the fray, what size it is, and what it's destination is, or it
could be left totally up to the co-GM to decide.
Imperials have similar problems with goals. They can't just sail around
blowing up any ship in sight. They should be setting sail in reaction to
increasing levels of piracy.
Frank
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In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> I'm sorry to have rebuffed you. I have been trying to figure out just
> how to use non-pirates in the game. There needs to be some additional
> background work done. I am also afraid that such additional background
> detail may be an additional load on an already overloaded GM.
Frank,
While I was not able to participate at the fest I have an idea or two:
- Maybe an Imperial Ship would act as a police type presence. Entering at a
random or GM determined point. Sort of on patrol and seeking to eliminate
any ship it encounters. Other pirates would seek to avoid it (staying out
of range) and might have to choose between facing the Imperial or another
Pirate.
- Merchants - Merchants could also transport prisoners which could provide a
source of manpower if the ship is captured.
Either way it would seem a second GM to handle non-pirate ships would be needed.
Just a coupla thoughts.
Jeff
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Jeff wrote:
> - Maybe an Imperial Ship would act as a police type presence. Entering at a
> random or GM determined point. Sort of on patrol and seeking to eliminate
> any ship it encounters. Other pirates would seek to avoid it (staying out
> of range) and might have to choose between facing the Imperial or another
> Pirate.
That is how we've used Imperial ships in the past, they would come out
when rampant acts of piracy were starting to occur.
> - Merchants - Merchants could also transport prisoners which could provide a
> source of manpower if the ship is captured.
An interesting idea, though generally the capture of a merchant ship is
plenty of incentive. Often though the crew of a merchant ship will join
the pirates.
Frank
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Frank Filz <ffilz@mindspring.com> wrote:
> Jeff wrote:
> > - Maybe an Imperial Ship would act as a police type presence. Entering at a
> > random or GM determined point. Sort of on patrol and seeking to eliminate
> > any ship it encounters. Other pirates would seek to avoid it (staying out
> > of range) and might have to choose between facing the Imperial or another
> > Pirate.
>
> That is how we've used Imperial ships in the past, they would come out
> when rampant acts of piracy were starting to occur.
...Maybe have it follow a random course each turn until a pirate got
within a fixed "sight range" at which point it would always move to
follow the closest pirate (so you could lure it closer to someone else
and make it follow them >-)
...I think we tossed this idea around before :-)
> > - Merchants - Merchants could also transport prisoners which could provide a
> > source of manpower if the ship is captured.
>
> An interesting idea, though generally the capture of a merchant ship is
> plenty of incentive. Often though the crew of a merchant ship will join
> the pirates.
...Stage secret mutinies! just make the merchants sufficiently different
than normal run of the mill pirates so you can tell them apart. After
taking a merchant crew on, there's some small chance that they will not
be happy. After X turns, the merchants mutiny, kill some number of
pirates, take some of the treasure and escape (either take them from the
game or put them on a nearby island to guard their new horde)
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! :-)
---
wubwub
wubwub@wildlink.com
jains.has.it <-- Jain's Guide
www.sitcatsit.com <-- a guy and his cat
www.wildlink.com <-- the wildlinks
Start planning for BrickFest 2003!
The AFOL Community's Premier Fan Run Event!
www.brickfest.com
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"Frank Filz" <ffilz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3D3ED3EF.38019A36@mindspring.com...
> Benjamin Medinets wrote:
> >
> > In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> > > Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam • in
> > > the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, • so
> > > I'll just free associate about the game...
> >
> > <beaucoup de snippage...> :)
> >
> > It looked like Larry didn't have a lot of luck this year... ;)
> >
> > The game looked very fun from what I saw of it. I was tempted to join • but
> > was "rebuffed" when I was told that I couldn't use Imperials or use • Islanders.
> >
> > I am not really a big fan of using "scurvy knaves" ... maybe next year
> > I can help Frank with controlling a NPC ship or the island of natives... • :)
>
> I'm sorry to have rebuffed you. I have been trying to figure out just
> how to use non-pirates in the game. There needs to be some additional
> background work done. I am also afraid that such additional background
> detail may be an additional load on an already overloaded GM.
I have run games with stats for the islanders and the witch doctors. The
players seem to have a blast playing them. I even let players control
creatures like the sea monster, squid, the mummy in the lost Egyptian
temple, the possibilities are vast. I write out cards with all the stats for
all figures and creatures and place them under the islands and forts.
Everything is prebagged with a duplicate card in the bag, so it cuts down on
my headaches. I also let the player complete construction of the island,
forts, and town. Some have been quite imaginative, but I have to admit that
the aggregate number of parts I bring to some of the gaming cons is
staggering. I know I would not be able to transport such a large amount of
material by plane, but could we ship materials to a local BrickFest
representative?
I have used the idea that imperials and pirates players could control a
merchant ship as well as a combat vessel. The merchant ship carries the
booty from point A to point B. The biggest problem is space. The pirates
want prize ships and treasure so they are influenced to send their cargo
back to the their own base. The imperials purpose to protect the merchants
and recapture stolen merchandise is the best motivation for the players
serving the empire.
> This years game was the first I didn't feel overwhelmed as a single GM,
> since I am finally comfortable with the rules, many of the other players
> are also comfortable, and I greatly simplified the island interaction.
>
> One problem is coming up with interesting goals for non-pirates which
> are reasonably balanced. Clearly, the ships can be balanced. I came up
> with a quick and dirty way to run the islander catamaran which basically
> made it equivalent to a cutter, though a different damage table would
> give it more flavor. But what is the goal of islanders? They aren't
> going to capture pirate ships and take them in to port to sell them. One
> idea I have is that for each European (pirate or imperial) ship
> captured, the islander captain would gain more followers and more
> islander boats.
Islanders and other groups usually have something everyone else wants like
treasure, also pirates and imperials trespass in their territory.
> I would love to have merchants be a viable playing position, but I'm
> just not sure how to set up the economic rules to work. Traditionally
> also, the merchants have been a way to capture a bigger ship, so how
> would one play that into the equation? On the other hand, someone
> clearly functioning as a co-GM could easily handle merchant ships. A
> simple table or card drawing system could determine where a new merchant
> enters the fray, what size it is, and what it's destination is, or it
> could be left totally up to the co-GM to decide.
>
> Imperials have similar problems with goals. They can't just sail around
> blowing up any ship in sight. They should be setting sail in reaction to
> increasing levels of piracy.
Usually in most games, increasing levels of piracy is not a problem : )
> Frank
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In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> First off, as has been mentioned before, this was absolutely the best
> game we have played so far. Some contributions to this were:
I agree, but I think that this is in spite of some things that you may feel it
is because of.
> - We were able to setup Friday night.
Very important! It would be even better if we could coordinate the game ahead
of time, and get more participation in island provision and crew/ship setup.
> I really simplified island play. Instead of having major scenario
> islands, most islands just had some buried treasure, or a stranded
> pirate or two or three. The most time spent on any island was about 5
> turns (3 separate islands). None of those islands required heavy
> interaction with me.
>
> - With more treasure to be had on the islands, several folks made it
> into port to sell captured ships and treasure and buy more gear or
> better ships.
I think it is good that there were lots of good quick simple islands. The more
the better. But I also think that there is benefit to more complex scenario
type islands. I've been reading through Steve's rules again and I note that
battle is supposed to happen independent of the overall timeline. I think
islands should work that way too. However, both of these absolutely require
someone to act as a sub-GM. I should have done that instead of playing and
trying to help where I could.
Selve-serve islands just like suttling, through a palm or laptop, would
minimize the need for GM interaction.
> Some things which may not have gone so well:
>
> - The only larger ships were three class 2 ships I brought. We were
> severely lacking when Scott Quirk (?) got a big treasure haul.
Yeah, we'll have to do better at coordinating this next time.
> - I probably made gems a little too valuable (they were word 1d6x10
> gold, if a 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x100 gold, and if yet
> another 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x200 gold).
I think the mined silver was similarly too valuable (or too quick to acquire).
> - I had talked about using a deck of cards for island contents, I think
> this would be a good idea.
Yup. Or software.
> - We didn't have enough range sticks. A combination of the K-8 not being
> out Friday, and the sparseness of it meant we had to improvise a bit. I
> am thinking about having some 2x4s engraved with numbers to use for
> making some range sticks.
Oooh. Good idea! I intend to bring more than two range sticks next year.
> - We were almost short of island material, though Lindsay came up with a
> couple clever ways to use all the palm tree bits Chris had brought
> amongst which was only a single palm tree fork. Duplo 2x2 bricks
> actually worked out to make nice little rocks (which tended to not be
> very interesting, though one chain made a handy way for some pirates to
> swim from one island to the next, and reduce the chance of attracting
> sharks).
I think Duplo in general is a tremendously valuable island tool, the potential
of which we have only scratched the surface.
> - NPC ships are just a pain,
Wow. I'm surprised at this. What hassle did they cause? Just remembering
them? Maybe this is evidence once again that a dedicated assistant GM is
really needed. I'll do it next year unless we automate stuff in the mean time.
> The Islander catamaran wasn't too much of a pain to
> run because it didn't last long.
It lasted long enough for me to sell it at port!
> - I needed to think a bit about the islands which were a little more
> interesting. The shrine was pretty easy when Kai Brodersen blew up the
> statue's head with a cannon ball (each pirate who spent a turn searching
> found 1d6 gold, with a 6 meaning a gem instead). On one large island,
> Lindsay stumbled into an alligator. On another, Larry found some silver
> worth mining (unfortunately, his ship and captain were killed and
> someone else [durn, forgot the name] captured the silver). On a third,
> some islanders were present, and put up a bit of a fight (and launched a
> catamaran which proceeded to nearly sweep Larry's new ship of crew,
> fortunately he was right next to an island populated by three stranded
> crew, and then headed to Strawberry Island to collect some giant
> strawberries and some more crew).
I still think it would be very cool to generally use the islanders more,
creating a simple political and economic model that governs their behavior.
That would take care of lots of islands and there would be a sensible "look and
feel" to how the islands effected the game.
> I'm thinking that most islands should be small (the 16x16 printed
> islands work great, but a few built up islands like the shrine or
> Strawberry Island [built from about 10 Duplo bricks - this provided
> cover for Larry once] would be nice also). The larger islands are harder
> to deal with since they can take several turns to explore. The island we
> used as a pirate base turned out to also provide some separation of the
> ocean which worked well.
I agree in general, feeling that it should be clear that the islands on the
floor -- like the ports, represent larger more complex environments. The
division of the sea by islands is to my thinking a very good thing. We had
scands of islands this time and I actually think that more would still be
better.
> When Scott realized he wasn't going to be able to crew all the ships he
> had to buy to spend his money, he negotiated with Shiri and (?) who were
Aaron?
> not in the best of shape. They helped crew his ships and the combined
> armada stood a good chance of sweeping the ocean had we more time. Of
Pisha! We could have outmaneuvered him and sown dissent among his partners.
> course Chris Weeks and Larry had joined in common cause, and Kai was
> potentially going to join them, which would have made it a close fight
> (but still with the advantage to Scott's fleet).
It depends on how long a pirate coalition like that could hold together.
> Lindsay and (?) capturing one ship, starting to tow it home, and then
> the other player back stabbing Lindsay just as Scott's fleet was about
> to set sail.
I think it was Nicholas Greene.
> The time two ships both destroyed each other's cannon (I think this was
> Larry and Shiri).
That was great. But I actually think the tables should be recomposed. The
chances of that happening are not exactly high, but I do think they're too
high.
I'm going to take this year to make some changes to the system and convince you
that they're appropriate to implement.
Chris
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Christopher Weeks wrote:
> > - We were able to setup Friday night.
>
> Very important! It would be even better if we could coordinate the game ahead
> of time, and get more participation in island provision and crew/ship setup.
Definitely would have helped. Over the next months, I plan on organizing
all my minifigs, so I may make up bags of pirate crews which would speed
up that part. More islands certainly would have helped.
> > I really simplified island play. Instead of having major scenario
> > islands, most islands just had some buried treasure, or a stranded
> > pirate or two or three. The most time spent on any island was about 5
> > turns (3 separate islands). None of those islands required heavy
> > interaction with me.
> >
> > - With more treasure to be had on the islands, several folks made it
> > into port to sell captured ships and treasure and buy more gear or
> > better ships.
>
> I think it is good that there were lots of good quick simple islands. The more
> the better. But I also think that there is benefit to more complex scenario
> type islands. I've been reading through Steve's rules again and I note that
> battle is supposed to happen independent of the overall timeline. I think
> islands should work that way too. However, both of these absolutely require
> someone to act as a sub-GM. I should have done that instead of playing and
> trying to help where I could.
I've never quite figured out the asynchronous play Steve suggests. That
was one area which really puzzled me for a long time since it almost
implies a separate map for large scale movement. One problem with that
style is that he suggests you can't enter an in progress battle. It
would also give a serious benefit to the skilled players.
I need to think more about scenario islands, but as other stuff becomes
more self serve, that will give me more time to handle scenario islands.
A 2nd GM would also make more time to handle such islands (and each GM
could handle the scenario on several islands).
Interestingly, we keep talking about how a 2nd GM would help things, and
then convince ourselves we don't need one, and then wish we had one. I
think it's becoming clear the Pirate Game is a big enough attraction
that we will get enough players to make two GMs worthwhile, and if the
2nd GM handles some (or all) of the NPC ships, then they will likely
have almost as much fun as if they were playing a pirate ship.
> Selve-serve islands just like suttling, through a palm or laptop, would
> minimize the need for GM interaction.
I will work on making the simple stuff self serve. Some suttling will
still need GM attention, but the bulk of it doesn't need attention.
> > Some things which may not have gone so well:
> >
> > - The only larger ships were three class 2 ships I brought. We were
> > severely lacking when Scott Quirk (?) got a big treasure haul.
>
> Yeah, we'll have to do better at coordinating this next time.
Of course this year we were probably somewhat in denial about the fact
that I wasn't going to be bringing enough ships to run the game all by
myself... I did try and hint that we needed some larger ships, but
Lindsay's project obviously took over...
> > - I probably made gems a little too valuable (they were word 1d6x10
> > gold, if a 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x100 gold, and if yet
> > another 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x200 gold).
>
> I think the mined silver was similarly too valuable (or too quick to acquire).
Perhaps, it did take several turns to acquire it though. But definitely
something which needs work.
> > - I had talked about using a deck of cards for island contents, I think
> > this would be a good idea.
>
> Yup. Or software.
I'm thinking cards as not introducing the possibilities of technical
difficulties. I also don't currently have a laptop which is useable
(plus a laptop is a major hassle when flying).
> > - We didn't have enough range sticks. A combination of the K-8 not being
> > out Friday, and the sparseness of it meant we had to improvise a bit. I
> > am thinking about having some 2x4s engraved with numbers to use for
> > making some range sticks.
>
> Oooh. Good idea! I intend to bring more than two range sticks next year.
I will make some up myself. I could have easily fit several into my big
box.
> > - We were almost short of island material, though Lindsay came up with a
> > couple clever ways to use all the palm tree bits Chris had brought
> > amongst which was only a single palm tree fork. Duplo 2x2 bricks
> > actually worked out to make nice little rocks (which tended to not be
> > very interesting, though one chain made a handy way for some pirates to
> > swim from one island to the next, and reduce the chance of attracting
> > sharks).
>
> I think Duplo in general is a tremendously valuable island tool, the potential
> of which we have only scratched the surface.
The disadvantage of Duplo is that minifigs can't stand on it. At one
point, three guys tried to stand on an island, and all but one kept
falling off. With a 4x4 LEGO island, it would have been trivial to get
three guys to stand. I may make up some small rocks though. That would
be a fun evening's project and would pack pretty easily.
> > - NPC ships are just a pain,
>
> Wow. I'm surprised at this. What hassle did they cause? Just remembering
> them? Maybe this is evidence once again that a dedicated assistant GM is
> really needed. I'll do it next year unless we automate stuff in the mean time.
The problem is plotting and/or remembering them. One thing is that the
plotting time is a time for me to catch my breath, and also the best
opportunity to run to the loo (which my digestive system was making me
do (doo...) rather often Saturday...). Automation of other tasks really
won't help much. I think the only effective way to use NPC ships is to
have a 2nd GM, or have a player who can be objective handle them
(Lindsay did a good job for several turns).
I'd also like for NPC ships to have the opportunity to have +1
initiative captains, plus, once larger ships come into play, PC ships
will be at the same initiative.
> > The Islander catamaran wasn't too much of a pain to
> > run because it didn't last long.
>
> It lasted long enough for me to sell it at port!
I meant it didn't last long as an NPC ship.
> > - I needed to think a bit about the islands which were a little more
> > interesting. The shrine was pretty easy when Kai Brodersen blew up the
> > statue's head with a cannon ball (each pirate who spent a turn searching
> > found 1d6 gold, with a 6 meaning a gem instead). On one large island,
> > Lindsay stumbled into an alligator. On another, Larry found some silver
> > worth mining (unfortunately, his ship and captain were killed and
> > someone else [durn, forgot the name] captured the silver). On a third,
> > some islanders were present, and put up a bit of a fight (and launched a
> > catamaran which proceeded to nearly sweep Larry's new ship of crew,
> > fortunately he was right next to an island populated by three stranded
> > crew, and then headed to Strawberry Island to collect some giant
> > strawberries and some more crew).
>
> I still think it would be very cool to generally use the islanders more,
> creating a simple political and economic model that governs their behavior.
> That would take care of lots of islands and there would be a sensible "look and
> feel" to how the islands effected the game.
Developing islanders is certainly worthwhile.
> > I'm thinking that most islands should be small (the 16x16 printed
> > islands work great, but a few built up islands like the shrine or
> > Strawberry Island [built from about 10 Duplo bricks - this provided
> > cover for Larry once] would be nice also). The larger islands are harder
> > to deal with since they can take several turns to explore. The island we
> > used as a pirate base turned out to also provide some separation of the
> > ocean which worked well.
>
> I agree in general, feeling that it should be clear that the islands on the
> floor -- like the ports, represent larger more complex environments. The
> division of the sea by islands is to my thinking a very good thing. We had
> scands of islands this time and I actually think that more would still be
> better.
I think too many more islands would have started to make sailing a real
hassle.
> > When Scott realized he wasn't going to be able to crew all the ships he
> > had to buy to spend his money, he negotiated with Shiri and (?) who were
>
> Aaron?
Yup.
<snip>
> Pisha! We could have outmaneuvered him and sown dissent among his partners. • <snip>
> It depends on how long a pirate coalition like that could hold together.
Always true.
> > The time two ships both destroyed each other's cannon (I think this was
> > Larry and Shiri).
>
> That was great. But I actually think the tables should be recomposed. The
> chances of that happening are not exactly high, but I do think they're too
> high.
It happened once at BricksWest also. I agree, the chance of cannon being
destroyed is too high. It effectively wipes out a cutter.
> I'm going to take this year to make some changes to the system and convince you
> that they're appropriate to implement.
I'm certainly all ears for new system ideas. I will be trying to work on
some myself, so please keep me in touch with your ideas.
I may have to get Steve's permission to publish an alternate set of
rules (I do have his new edition of battle rules in MS Word format, all
ready to edit). I also would like to come up with new ship record
sheets. One thing I also want to re-visit is the chain shot rule. It
simply has to be made more effective. Some clarification of the crossing
the T rules would be good too (including formalizing my rule for
determining them - a crossing the T happens when your line of fire
enters the ship through the bow or stern, and leaves the focsle/poop
deck before crossing the gunnels. It seems to consistently represent a
30 degree or smaller arc which seems reasonable and is easy to eyeball
rather than having to get out a protractor or something.
Frank
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Thanks for the fast writeup, Frank! And thanks again
for running such a great game. I think having a few
people around who could handle the "normal" activities
of movement and combat meant that when one of us was
near contentious happenings, we could handle it ourselves
(as I did in our little spate of combat over by the Pirate
Island).
In lugnet.fun.gaming, Frank Filz writes:
> Well, I didn't take many pictures, and I don't think we had a web cam in
> the room, so I won't be able to do a turn by turn re-cap of the game, so
> I'll just free associate about the game...
I took some, but they were all turns 15-17 (see my email to
you from Sunday). I can put them up on Brickshelf later
this week.
> First off, as has been mentioned before, this was absolutely the best
> game we have played so far. Some contributions to this were:
>
> - We were able to setup Friday night.
And we were able to change rooms, very important indeed!
Unfortunately I was not a lot of help, for which I feel
badly. (And I forgot sails and rig for my cutters, oi.)
> - Almost all of the participants were able to play the whole game.
That was definitely a strength--and that very few got
really discouraged by adversity; Jason Mantor in particular
was especially fun because his mood never soured, and he
picked up a new cutter and soldiered on!
> - I really simplified island play. Instead of having major scenario
> islands, most islands just had some buried treasure, or a stranded
> pirate or two or three. The most time spent on any island was about 5
> turns (3 separate islands). None of those islands required heavy
> interaction with me.
I think this has proven that the system for the islands is
more important than the beauty of the islands--and I liked
the card idea you broached during the weekend.
> - With more treasure to be had on the islands, several folks made it
> into port to sell captured ships and treasure and buy more gear or
> better ships.
>
> Some things which may not have gone so well:
>
> - The only larger ships were three class 2 ships I brought. We were
> severely lacking when Scott Quirk (?) got a big treasure haul.
I'll take the lumps for that. I had the most stuff at home
to build larger ships, and I ran out of time (my bad time
management) before Fest. If I'd been thinking, I would at
least have pulled together the fixings for some Armada Flag-
ships.
Next year, of course, I won't be in-country at all; if anyone
wishes I can loan my cutters to someone (say Chris) and/or my
hull pieces and island plates so they may be used next year.
> - I probably made gems a little too valuable (they were word 1d6x10
> gold, if a 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x100 gold, and if yet
> another 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x200 gold).
I noticed this; maybe make the steps x10/x20/x40/x80 or
some slightly lower exponential?
> - We didn't have enough range sticks. A combination of the K-8 not being
> out Friday, and the sparseness of it meant we had to improvise a bit. I
> am thinking about having some 2x4s engraved with numbers to use for
> making some range sticks.
Do you think the HPT guys would allow a bulk discount? I'd
be happy to put in $5-$10 for my own range stick. If you
want to take up a Pirate Game materials collection, let me
know.
> - We were almost short of island material, though Lindsay came up with a
> couple clever ways to use all the palm tree bits Chris had brought
> amongst which was only a single palm tree fork. Duplo 2x2 bricks
> actually worked out to make nice little rocks (which tended to not be
> very interesting, though one chain made a handy way for some pirates to
> swim from one island to the next, and reduce the chance of attracting
> sharks).
A couple of the building ideas we came up with shall become
standard for me, I think! The Duplo bricks did work well,
and the hopping pirate trick was one of the highlights of
the game--pirates chasing their ship.
> - NPC ships are just a pain, I suspect this is one reason Steve runs
> only battle games now. I put Lindsay in charge of one of the merchants
> at one point. Actually, I think neither merchant really did much (except
> the 2nd one got a good shot on Larry), though the 2nd one may have been
> captured near the end (the 1st got off almost unscathed, despite sailing
> right at Shiri...). The Islander catamaran wasn't too much of a pain to
> run because it didn't last long.
I had only started playing the 2d merchant when we broke up the
game for the evening. However, I was clearly doomed, being in
the middle of the Aaron/Scott/Shiri Combined Fleet.
> I'm thinking that most islands should be small (the 16x16 printed
> islands work great, but a few built up islands like the shrine or
> Strawberry Island [built from about 10 Duplo bricks - this provided
> cover for Larry once] would be nice also). The larger islands are harder
> to deal with since they can take several turns to explore. The island we
> used as a pirate base turned out to also provide some separation of the
> ocean which worked well.
I liked the tricky navigation. The idea of having some spaces
where a cutter can pass but not a class 2 or 3 or more is a
good one! I did, however, think that we needed to cut down
"free moves" from 2 points on the compass to one at the start
of a move.
> When Scott realized he wasn't going to be able to crew all the ships he
> had to buy to spend his money, he negotiated with Shiri and (?) who were
> not in the best of shape. They helped crew his ships and the combined
> armada stood a good chance of sweeping the ocean had we more time. Of
> course Chris Weeks and Larry had joined in common cause, and Kai was
> potentially going to join them, which would have made it a close fight
> (but still with the advantage to Scott's fleet).
(?) = Aaron Sneary.
> The time Kai knocked his ship over and sent two crew flying. Followed
> shortly by knocking the top of the mast off.
And hit it with the range stick, and again, and again. He angered
the statue gods!
> Lindsay and (?) capturing one ship, starting to tow it home, and then
> the other player back stabbing Lindsay just as Scott's fleet was about
> to set sail.
I think it was Nick Greene. The owner of said ship, whose captain
got duly plugged and sent to Davy Jones's Locker, was Jason Mantor
(still the game's best sport, as far as I'm concerned). He also
put his captain overboard thanks to a bad brush of the hand.
The worst part was on the last turn of the ship's life, when I
shot my cannon in hopes of killing a crewman and instead took down
the mast (after missing horribly for such a long time). Then,
when Nick backstabbed me and my crew was in disarray, I still
came out on top thanks to "saved luck." :D
And, of course, I knocked my own captain into the sea just as
my ship went into port to escape the Combined Fleet. A good
time was had by all!
best
LFB
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Mr L F Braun wrote:
> > First off, as has been mentioned before, this was absolutely the best
> > game we have played so far. Some contributions to this were:
> >
> > - We were able to setup Friday night.
>
> And we were able to change rooms, very important indeed!
> Unfortunately I was not a lot of help, for which I feel
> badly. (And I forgot sails and rig for my cutters, oi.)
Yes, thanks to the Animation folks for not needing their room. I think
we also gained one or two players who got suckered into the game instead
of playing with animation stuff... But you were a help on Friday. You
came up with a couple alternate palm ideas, and it seems you did some
work on pirate crews.
> > - Almost all of the participants were able to play the whole game.
>
> That was definitely a strength--and that very few got
> really discouraged by adversity; Jason Mantor in particular
> was especially fun because his mood never soured, and he
> picked up a new cutter and soldiered on!
One thing which helped keep up interest was a much smoother play, though
it did start to drag at the end (but then several folks were doing
suttling stuff at the same time).
> > - I really simplified island play. Instead of having major scenario
> > islands, most islands just had some buried treasure, or a stranded
> > pirate or two or three. The most time spent on any island was about 5
> > turns (3 separate islands). None of those islands required heavy
> > interaction with me.
>
> I think this has proven that the system for the islands is
> more important than the beauty of the islands--and I liked
> the card idea you broached during the weekend.
Well, beauty of the islands does help set a tone. But agree, the most
important thing is the game aspects, and that they be simple to run.
> I'll take the lumps for that. I had the most stuff at home
> to build larger ships, and I ran out of time (my bad time
> management) before Fest. If I'd been thinking, I would at
> least have pulled together the fixings for some Armada Flag-
> ships.
>
> Next year, of course, I won't be in-country at all; if anyone
> wishes I can loan my cutters to someone (say Chris) and/or my
> hull pieces and island plates so they may be used next year.
If Chris could hold onto your cutters, that would be cool. I wonder if
we could get LD to donate a pirate set or two for prizes. With some
prizes dangling, we might be able to attract people to bring a ship MOC
or two. Next year I'll also scout out possible loaners from the Castle
room if we look short on bigger ships (also, in the future, I would like
to be able to leave my Wolfpack cutters in the Castle room - I could
have this year, except they were some of the few ships with sails).
> > - I probably made gems a little too valuable (they were word 1d6x10
> > gold, if a 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x100 gold, and if yet
> > another 6 was rolled, they were worth 1d6x200 gold).
>
> I noticed this; maybe make the steps x10/x20/x40/x80 or
> some slightly lower exponential?
That might work. What needs to happen most is that island treasures are
worth enough to be worth spending time on islands instead of trying to
capture other ships.
> > - We didn't have enough range sticks. A combination of the K-8 not being
> > out Friday, and the sparseness of it meant we had to improvise a bit. I
> > am thinking about having some 2x4s engraved with numbers to use for
> > making some range sticks.
>
> Do you think the HPT guys would allow a bulk discount? I'd
> be happy to put in $5-$10 for my own range stick. If you
> want to take up a Pirate Game materials collection, let me
> know.
I need to contact them and find out what the costs are.
> > I'm thinking that most islands should be small (the 16x16 printed
> > islands work great, but a few built up islands like the shrine or
> > Strawberry Island [built from about 10 Duplo bricks - this provided
> > cover for Larry once] would be nice also). The larger islands are harder
> > to deal with since they can take several turns to explore. The island we
> > used as a pirate base turned out to also provide some separation of the
> > ocean which worked well.
>
> I liked the tricky navigation. The idea of having some spaces
> where a cutter can pass but not a class 2 or 3 or more is a
> good one! I did, however, think that we needed to cut down
> "free moves" from 2 points on the compass to one at the start
> of a move.
That may work out ok, though if that's done, then we definitely need a
way to pass through the wind without losing a turn (at least right now,
you can take a 90 degree turn through the wind at the beginning of your
turn). I need to look at some of my other sailing games and see how they
handle sailing rules.
> > The time Kai knocked his ship over and sent two crew flying. Followed
> > shortly by knocking the top of the mast off.
>
> And hit it with the range stick, and again, and again. He angered
> the statue gods!
Sure did, though it didn't seem to have much effect after the initial
problems... It might be interesting though to have some effect for
angering the gods...
> The worst part was on the last turn of the ship's life, when I
> shot my cannon in hopes of killing a crewman and instead took down
> the mast (after missing horribly for such a long time). Then,
> when Nick backstabbed me and my crew was in disarray, I still
> came out on top thanks to "saved luck." :D
Another reason we need effective chain shot rules. Chain shot doesn't
take down masts (though it can do serious rigging damage).
> And, of course, I knocked my own captain into the sea just as
> my ship went into port to escape the Combined Fleet. A good
> time was had by all!
There were several "null effect" men over board, your captain being one
of them.
Oh, another thing I really need to work out is beastie rules. If I'm
going to throw land beasts, they need definitive rules (I was letting
the gators save on a 1-4 on one die - I think that's easier than giving
them hit points).
Frank
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Grr...
I'll probably respond to all the comments tonight. I have one post on it's way,
but something in our firewall at work is making it take a minute or two to open
an NNTP connection, and I hate editing messages in the web poster (no spell
check and all).
Frank
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I'd like to thank Frank and everyone else who made this game happen. I got
suckered because I thought I was going to see some animation stuff, but due
to the room change, I wandered into the begining stages of the game. After
a few minutes of lurking, I grabbed a Ship and jumped into the fray. It was
a lot of fun. I didn't think I'd like it, but I figure I'm addicted now : )
My first cutter must have been cursed, because it continued to bring people
(mostly Lindsey) bad luck even after the crew was dead and the broken hulk
was taken in tow ! Anyway, I can't wait to do this again...
-JSM
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