Subject:
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Re: Pirate Game Questions
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.pirates
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Date:
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Wed, 13 Jun 2001 03:25:59 GMT
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Viewed:
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1221 times
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Bruce Schlickbernd wrote:
> In lugnet.pirates, Roy Riggs writes:
> > I have a few more pirate game questions for those of you with more
> > experience..
<re-ordering...>
> Hopefully Frank Filz will give you a response - I'd trust his opinion over
> mine in regards to the intent of the rules.
Hopefully Steve will chime in also (Steve are you there?). You may also
want to e-mail Steve directly.
Some general thoughts:
- Note that the game was developed as a game mastered game, so the rules
have some imprecision.
- The game also has a primary purpose of fun as opposed to simulation
- A game master has an obligation to try and make the game fun for the
players, this involves balancing the conflicting needs of "rules lawyer"
players and "hey I just want to sail my ship around, role play a bit,
and shoot up some Imperials" players.
I've trimmed the questions that I don't have anything to add to what
Bruce said.
> > 1. It says all damage is simultaneous during combat. Does that mean ALL
> > combat, or each type of combat? For instance, if a pirate is shot by a
> > cannon, does he still get to fire his musket? Or if a pirate is killed
> > by a musket, can he still attack with his cutlass?
>
> Hmmmm, well, I handled cannon fire during ship movement, then resolved
> minifig combat. Part of this is answered below.
Yes, the two types of combat are distinct. Each phase is taken in turn,
and all activity within a phase is simultaneous.
> > 3. If a sailor needs to move to accomplish something like loading a
> > cannon, does he get to move and load the cannon in the same turn, or
> > does his movement count as his action during the turn and he'll load it
> > next turn?
>
> Kinda grey - movement isn't specifically listed as an "action". At the same
> time, boarding combat specifically says you can move and fight.
> Significantly, the other actions don't list movement. I would think not for
> cannon.
Note that movement is during a separate phase from cannon fire or small
arms fire, though crew is allowed to move 1" to dodge cannon. I'd be
inclined to allow crew within 1" of a cannon to man the cannon.
For my own game, I will be doing some thinking about cannon. I've been
thinking about changing how many cannon are allowed etc. So I will
probably revisit this. I do want to end up with less complex rules if at
all possible.
> > 4. If a sailor wants to be 'prudent' (aka jump overboard on a sinking
> > ship) does he need to declare that as his action during the turn, or can
> > he fire a musket and then jump before the hull damage phase?
>
> Move and fight, fight and move. Since there aren't any reload rules, I'd
> probably opt for not allowing movement and firing, but as the rules stand, I
> would think you can.
Based on the phasing, movement comes before small arms fire, so I would
say "being prudent" is a movement action.
In fact, looking at the phasing, I'm inclined to move crew movement to
before cannon fire (hmm, no, just changed my mind). Part of me also
wants to require some of the sailing crew to be aloft, but I'm not sure
how to handle this, and not all ship models can actually have crew aloft
(though I'm converting ships to studs up spars, I finally completed my
first SES which has been languishing for over a year without spars and
sails - not only did I do her with studs up spars, but she also got red
spars, I also finally fitted out the Red Seas Barracuda with her red
spars - thanks everyone who traded me red 1x4 plates with towball).
I think the purpose of putting crew movement after cannon fire was to
allow the crew phases to be skipped if they didn't matter much due to
distance between ships.
> > 5. When a cannon is close to 'crossing the T' of another ship, is the
> > attacking player required to take the crossing the T minus to hit in
> > exchange for two damage rolls? Or can they decide which way they want to
> > play it? If they have multiple cannons, could they choose differently
> > for each?
>
> The ship does not magically turn sideways, so no, you shouldn't have a
> choice. You have a narrow target but if you hit it, the ball is going to
> travel along the length of the ship, creating havoc.
Here's a thought for a pretty simple rule for determining if you're
crossing the T. From the cannon closest to the enemy ship, trace a
straight line the direction the cannon is pointing. If the line crosses
the curved portion of a bow or stern section and exits the ship in a
different hull section, you are crossing the T. This actually amounts to
just about 45 degrees to either side of the centerline, so perhaps
that's the best rule, though that seems a bit restrictive, on the other
hand, it also fits the compass points. So, I'm inclined to make the
simple rule stand. Another simple rule would be 22.5 degrees to either
side of the center line. This also is a reasonable measure to use since
it fits with how you determine which compass point your ship is on in
gauging wind effects.
> > 7. Tactical Question - It seems to us after playing, that its vastly
> > more effective to always aim at the deck and never bother with
> > grapeshot. It takes forever to do enough hull or rigging damage to make
> > them worthwhile. Grapeshot is just to risky and doesn't do enough
> > damage to justify the risk. I could see where in a campaign game if you
> > were just trying to escape another foe that rigging shots could be worth
> > it. Do you think we just aren't following the rules properly?
> >
> > Thanks in advance!
> > Roy
>
> I'm not sure I agree with the results that you get from the rules as it
> stands, so I tend to feel it is a matter of balance. Historically, shooting
> up the rigging (a favorite French tactic) didn't work that well in actually
> winning a fight. If the other ship had carronades (short range cannons that
> throw heavy shot), or I was trying to sail away, I'd think about it.
> Grapeshot was something you only really used prepatory to boarding (or
> preventing such). Hull shots: it wasn't that easy to sink a wooden ship
> quickly. But I'm not sure that aiming at the hull and the deck was
> something that was that precise. You could aim low, hoping for a below
> waterline hit, but you caused the most casualties with solid shot by hitting
> the hull (flying splinters). I'm in favor of combining the two charts for
> solid shot.
Per http://news.lugnet.com/fun/gaming/?n=419 Steve Jackson himself
admits that the damage charts are flawed. He indicated he would like to
encourage more hull shots.
Frank
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Message is in Reply To:
 | | Re: Pirate Game Questions
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| (...) Hmmmm, well, I handled cannon fire during ship movement, then resolved minifig combat. Part of this is answered below. (...) Yes. (...) No. The purpose is to allow you to change course based on the events as they stood at the end of the (...) (23 years ago, 12-Jun-01, to lugnet.pirates)
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