Subject:
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Re: Star Wars is both sci-fi and fantasy (was: Re: Science fiction)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.fun, lugnet.starwars
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Date:
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Tue, 2 Nov 1999 23:13:22 GMT
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Reply-To:
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jsproat@{IHateSpam}io.com
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Viewed:
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614 times
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Todd Lehman wrote:
> Arghh, pet peeve alert! Star Wars is BOTH fantasy AND sci-fi.
Hold that thought, I'll get back to that...
> Jeremy, any particular reason you used fuzzy phrases like "more inclined"
> and "almost certainly not"? Right -- because it's not 100% one or the
> other. :-)
Well, my main reason is that it is really hard to define what science fiction
*IS*; it's easier to say what it *ISN'T*. I had to be less than absolute
because Star Wars shows features of both fantasy and science fiction. But on
the whole, it is a heckuva lot more fantasy than sci-fi.
> IMHO, parts of Star Wars that set foot in the "sci-fi" category include
> things like:
> - Hyperspace/hyperdrive
> - Self-aware droids/robots
> - Roboticized prosthetic hands/limbs
> - Repulsorlift vehicles
> - Shield generators
> - Lightsaber technology
> - Holographic games
> - Carbon freeze/thaw
> - Blowing up an entire planet with a mega-laser
> - Military space station the size of a moon
> - Floating city in the clouds (Bespin)
> - Planetary-scale city (Coruscant)
Pet peeve alert! ;-)
These things are technology, hardware, tools, devices, window dressing, etc.
They're not story items, but rather they support story items. Their presence
alone doesn't define the nature of their context. They have to be integral to
the story (and a few of these are); they have to affect it profoundly.
But if all you do is hand me a socket wrench, I am still a terrible auto
mechanic. I'm fantasy with hardware.
For us true hardcore sci-fi fans (1), who grew up on Heinlein and Niven and
Asimov and Silverberg -- these authors and others defined science fiction --
the *story* does more categorization than do the props used in that story.
Nor does sci-fi need the hardware to be sci-fi -- Dan Simmons and David Brin
have written some very good examples of sci-fi without hardware. (2)
<LIT_THESIS_MATERIAL SRC="jsproat/brain.fevered">
There are three basic stories you can tell: Man vs. Man, Man vs. God (or
Nature), and Man vs. Himself (i.e. his passions and his creations --
Technology). Man vs. God was perhaps the fisrt story told, and has formed the
basis of fantasy storytelling as we know it. Man vs. Man is largely defined
by history, and was adopted early on as a re-telling of such. Man vs. Himself
is a very new addition, and until this century's infestation of sci-fi authors
has had little real use.
Science fiction absolutely thrives on Man vs. Himself and its stepchildren:
Man vs. Technology and Man As God vs. Man. The antagonist in Stanger in a
Strange Land wasn't the hostile Earth society, it wasn't disillusioned
followers of Valentine; it was the naivate of Valentine himself. In 2001, the
core of the conflict was created when HAL 9000, a man's creation, was given a
confusing moral dilemma. In the Caves of Steel, Lije's conflict lies in his
reluctance to accept the robot Olivaw as an equal.
Star Wars shows a lot of the Man vs. God elements -- unstoppable and
ultra-powerful elites on either side of the conflict (our heroes and vilians),
wide sweeping generalizations of entire races (Jawas stink, Alderaaners are
peaceful, Corellians make good cargo ships), ultimate destinies (follow the
Force and you'll be real keen), etc. It also does well in the Man vs. Man
area -- i.e. Luke's life is influenced by Vader's actions, the Rebel Alliance
faces the consequence of being out-gunned and out-manned.
But it really lacks in the Man vs. Himself area. Han's bad habits rarely
catch up with him. Leia feels little remorse after her actions can't prevent
Alderaan's destruction. Blowing the DS2 so close to a planet is okay because
while all life on that world is dead within a week, a greater goal was
served. These things are destined so don't worry about them.
But please note that in my previous post I brought up the storyline of TESB.
Many Man vs. Himself elements are present in that movie -- the long struggle
between Luke and Vader (really within themselves, for they are the same
character with different influences), the angst in Leia's and Han's new
relationship, etc. By the same token, the post-ROTJ comic Dark Empire had
heaping spoonfuls of Man vs. Himself -- Leia reconciling the fact that Vader
was her father, the Emperor recovering from death, the Rebel Alliance coping
with the administration of the galaxy they just won, etc.
If Lucas had done more to humanize his main characters, and make it more real
life with hardware, that might have done thie job IMO. But for the large
part, Star Wars is just fantasy with hardware.
I know I sound real anal-retentive about this definition. (FWIW, I still ache
when people try to re-define "hacker" to include only crackers and phreaks
with balck hats.) If what all science fiction needs to be called science
fiction is hardware, the really good stories will get rarer and rarer in my
favorite story-telling genre.
</LIT_THESIS_MATERIAL>
> The IMDB (www.imdb.com) does even better -- it classifies Star Wars in four
> genres:
> 1. Sci-Fi
> 2. Fantasy
> 3. Action
> 4. Adventure
> Wouldn't you agree that's much more accurate than arguing over whether or
> not SW is fantasy or sci-fi? :-)
Well, sure. But -- er -- Wednesdays are black and white for me. Boolean
Value Wednesdays. Yah, that's the ticket. :-,
That, and I just finished a really good Dan Simmons book...
Cheers,
- jsproat
1. I think I'll start a religion. Hmmm...United Fundamentalist Fellowship of
Asimov -- UFFA! :-P
2. Sidenote -- some of what is categorized as horror really is science
fiction as well. A *good* example is The Stand by Stephen King. It has all
the good stuff: Man vs. Everything. :-,
--
Jeremy H. Sproat <jsproat@io.com> ~~~ http://www.io.com/~jsproat/
It's not the same log. It's not the same log. It's not the same log.
It's not the same log. It's not the same log. It's not the same log.
It's the same log. It's the same log. It's the same log.
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