Subject:
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Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Thu, 6 Jan 2000 19:20:31 GMT
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johnneal@uswest.&AntiSpam&net
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1741 times
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<3874A730.471E9696@voyager.net> <slrn879ac2.3ti.mattdm@jadzia.bu.edu>
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Matthew Miller wrote:
> Larry Pieniazek <lar@voyager.net> wrote:
> > Yes. Unless you're a big fan of "the ends justify the means". Good
> > outcomes do not justify pernicious mechanisms for achieving them.
>
> I'm not saying anything about justifying anything. "Ends justify the means"
> implies some sort of need for justificiation, and as I said, I'm assuming
> neither a totally evil government nor totally evil capitalists.
What Larry is saying is that the guv steals its money from the populace.
Therefore, anything done with that money good or bad is wrong because of *how*
it was obtained.
> > But from a utilitarian argument, government programs just don't work,
>
> Not true. They may not work as well as some other system might, but they
> certainly work to some degree. Otherwise, our country -- certainly currently
> involving a lot of government programs, like it or not -- would have
> collapsed a long time ago, yeah?
If they work, then how come this country has spent trillions of $$$ on welfare
and we still have poverty? Do you know how much a trillion is? I don't,
because the number is so vast. But I can tell you that it should have been
more than enough. Of course, $.70-.80 on the dollar probably went to the
bureaucracy.....
-John
> Government food programs _do_ feed some
> starving people.
So do charities. Free.
> Government highways do get some people from place to place.
> Government policing force does something to help maintain order. They
> _work_, even if there is an ideal situation which may be better.
What a silly thing to say. If there *is* a better solution, why not take it?
> > and from a rights based argument, they are evil usurpations of private
> > property.
>
> From _some_ rights based arguments. I'll get into this in a seperate post.
>
> --
> Matthew Miller ---> mattdm@mattdm.org
> Quotes 'R' Us ---> http://quotes-r-us.org/
>
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