Subject:
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Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Sun, 2 Jan 2000 21:04:12 GMT
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Viewed:
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1711 times
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Jasper Janssen wrote in message <3898af73.961769278@lugnet.com>...
> On Sat, 1 Jan 2000 23:19:43 GMT, Larry Pieniazek <lar@voyager.net>
> wrote:
> Just as explanation, of course, since I don't expect either of us can
> sway each other (if I had been constitutionally able to be swayed
> toward the LP, I'd have been so by now. Too many _good_ debaters have
> tried..).
Jasper, never give up.
> > So I always try to turn it round. Why does everyone else believe people
> > are bad? What a downer if that's what you really think?
Larry, I had not thought this through until today, so it may be wrong.
As compared to a perfect God, I would think man is evil, because he is far
from perfect (although, I'll bow and admit your very close!) But maybe that
is wrong. Maybe there is no God, maybe I have deluded my self. Going your
way, with no God to compare to, I will submit that man is neither good or
bad, simply man. Given a choice to do bad or good, he will take the easier
option assuming that in the end result for him, the good outweighs the bad -
if he can be bad with little consequence, then he will. So, basically the
same conclusion is drawn - man is evil (or bad, if evil seems any worse, for
some reason). If you are an exception to the norm, then thank those who
raised you so extraordinarily. When everyone in the world raises people
like you, we will probably be damn near Utopia.
> No kidding is it a downer. I suspect this realisation is a big part of
> puberty depression.
Puberty depression, I suppose you mean the required loss of innocence,
the childish web of ideas that held our fragile world together. I am sure
this is harder for some than for others, dependent on the amount of coping
that was required to withstand childhood. I admit this started early and
ended late for me, but I think I am past it. Over time, I gave up, admitted
the world wasn't to my liking, accepted how it actually is and began down
the road of making the best of it.
> > Why not believe
> > in the best of people, expect it, and deal with it if you don't get it,
> > instead of expecting the worst.
But, this doesn't sound like puberty depression (~or depression at
all~!). This sounds a little different. Devise a system where the
consequences of choosing bad over good are not attractive - where the
penalty for the bad action is equal to the action itself. Then see which
choice most people make most of the time! You will find that they are much
more good than you like to believe.
> I always believe the best of a person. I'll also always believe the
> worst of people. It's the way group dynamics work. Unfortunately.
If you think of all people as singular individuals rather than big groups
of people, you might be able to see the other side more easily. Everyone of
us is an individual, it just doesn't seem like most of "them" are.
--
Have fun!
John
The Legos you've been dreaming of...
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/lego
my weird Lego site:
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/
"Censorship is yet another tool in the dumbing-down of America
by a power structure that relies on a populace too lazy or ignorant
to think independently." -Vanessa McGrady
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