Debate : 24624


Off-Topic / Debate / 24624	24623 \| 24625

Subject:	Re: We'll take in your poor, your homeless, your oppressed...
Newsgroups:	lugnet.off-topic.debate
Date:	Tue, 6 Jul 2004 22:07:54 GMT
Viewed:	929 times

In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Leonard Hoffman wrote: > > But overthrowing Saddam in itself is not "unjust". > > Would you mind providing why you think this? That he is a genocidal tyrant that has additionally invaded two of his neighbors soley to steal their resources springs to mind. Or are you saying that Saddam's actions are "just"? > > I think we'd all agree that war, all things being equal, tends to be unjust. Unjust things happen during any war - however, from a given perspective, not all that wage war are unjust in doing so. And please note that we are only speaking hypothetically - I would have been quite happy to see the U.N. go in and stomp Saddam, while at the same time I think Bush is an idiot for doing the same thing unilaterally. > Furthermore, Saddam was the recognized (by us) legitimate ruler of a sovereign > nation. He did thumb his nose at UN resolutions, but none of those resolutions > questioned his legitimacy or the sovereignity of Iraq. None of this really has anything to do with just and unjust. > > Are you're saying that Saddam was a jerk and therefore waging war to overthrow > him was just? I merely disputed the assumption that David made that the war was "unjust". I'll also dispute "illegal". I won't dispute "stupid", "unsanctioned", "trumped-up", and any number of terms uncomplimentary to Dubya. > Then why don't be just go around the globe overthrowing random > other jerks? Because it would be just as big a waste as this attempt is? Mind you, in theory it isn't such a bad idea. In practice, I'm sure it would be a fiasco. -->Bruce<-- And I suppose I should mention in passing that I hope Canada grants asylum to the deserters

Message has 3 Replies:

		Re: We'll take in your poor, your homeless, your oppressed...
(...) Much of which he did with US support. (...) Seriously, was he any worse in 2003 than some of the human rights abusers Bush supports today? I’m talking about countries like Saudi Arabia, Israel, Azerbaijan and Uzbekistan. Scott A (...) (20 years ago, 7-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

		Re: We'll take in your poor, your homeless, your oppressed...
(...) Why? I find myself with complicated reactions to the situation that I haven't yet worked through. Were they dodging slavery (the draft), then I would assert that they had the moral high ground and I would be supportive of their desertion. But (...) (20 years ago, 7-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

		Re: We'll take in your poor, your homeless, your oppressed...
(...) I'm not suggesting, nor making any statement, that Saddam's actions are just. I'm questioning whether the USA's actions were just. Or rather, specifically, wondering why you think they were "not unjust." (...) I'm speaking hypthetically as (...) (20 years ago, 8-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

Message is in Reply To:

		Re: We'll take in your poor, your homeless, your oppressed...
(...) Would you mind providing why you think this? I think we'd all agree that war, all things being equal, tends to be unjust. Furthermore, Saddam was the recognized (by us) legitimate ruler of a sovereign nation. He did thumb his nose at UN (...) (20 years ago, 6-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

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