Subject:
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Re: Fair use and allusion?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 21 Jun 2004 20:10:37 GMT
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Viewed:
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978 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler wrote:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek wrote:
>
> > But who on this list is surprised? Moore is entirely without shame and his
> > approach to his work is entirely without merit. That he happens to be on the
> > right side of the issue this time is fortuitous coincidence for him, nothing
> > more.
> >
> > But I would argue that the issue of Bush's complicity in sparking an
> > unnecessary war would be better served by Moore's keeping his mouth entirely
> > shut, as his arguing in favour of something tends to suggest that being
> > against that particular something might be the better course to a large
> > number of people, including myself.
>
> That's pure ad hominem reasoning,
Why? Is it ad hominem against short sellers to point out that when short interst
is high is often a good time to buy stock? (1) It is not. It is merely an
observation of a useful negative correlation. Same thing holds here, Moore is a
liar and gets his facts wrong and therefore we have a good metric for judging
issues based on his track record, whatever side he is on is more likely(2) to be
wrong.
> and it's beneath you. I reject
> Libertarianism because Harry Browne and John Stossel are jerks. Does that
> make more or less sense than your own dismissal of causes that Moore
> embraces?
Less. Rather a LOT less, actually.
Moore is a jerk(3) because of his methods, (or if you like, he chooses to use
his methods because he's a jerk, it matters not to me) but it's not the methods,
rather his previous outcomes that lead me to my conclusion... he tends to be
wrong about stuff so betting against him is a good way to bet. Some people won't
look past that and will take it as revealed truth. Hence his alignment with any
cause does it a disservice. (similar effects can be seen with people like Rush
Limbaugh or Bill O'Reilly)
But further, if you have a scoundrel espousing a cause that reflects badly on
the cause. That's not ad hominem, it's merely an observation.
In passing, why is John Stossel a jerk? I rather like him. You can have Harry
Browne (4) though.
1 - It is a good time to buy because, statistically, short sellers tend to be
wrong, and they tend to be most wrong when they are most convinced they are
right... that is, when overall short interest is high.
2 - NOT guaranteed, merely more likely
3 - that's a bit closer to ad hominem but it's still not. It's merely an
observation of his lack of social graces, I say nothing about any correlation
between his jerkness and correctness.
4 - and I'll throw in Howard Stern for free.
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: Fair use and allusion?
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| (...) Because you are, in the post-at-hand, dismissing causes solely because Moore supports them. You may have additional reasoning that you haven't shared here, but since it's not yet been introduced in this discussion, it's irrelevant. Although (...) (20 years ago, 21-Jun-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: Fair use and allusion?
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| I happened to find an interesting cite. I think it's germane to the section of the post below I haven't trimmed away (...) This is an op-ed piece written by Ellen Goodman: (URL) found this para particularly relevant: "Moore described his movie as an (...) (20 years ago, 2-Sep-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Fair use and allusion?
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| (...) Since common courtesy is in the eye of the beholder, and since a title can certainly be spoofed without seeking the indulgence of the title's holder, then Bradbury is left with nothing but sour grapes. Sorry, Ray, but that's how it goes in the (...) (20 years ago, 21-Jun-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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