Subject:
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Re: From Richard: "It's all bad news - Chaos is my fault"
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Thu, 3 Jun 2004 19:38:11 GMT
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Viewed:
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1797 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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I think in FMJ, 8-Ball is shot in the leg.
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Ross Crawford wrote:
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“Peace cannot be kept by force; it can only be achieved by
understanding.” - Albert Einstein
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But it is achieved by force.
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You mean like in Israel/Palestine? Or do you mean like in WW1?
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First, Israel’s restraint has perpetuated the conflict with the
Palestinians.
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John, your blind support for Israel, despite the “facts on the
ground”, is rather unsophisticated.
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Yeah, and am I to suppose that your blind support for terrorism is
sophisticated? Please.
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That is rather offensive. I won’t even bother to ask you to justify
your statement.
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In this group I have already shown you how Israel is
a belligerent power which is currently led by an alleged war
criminal and fraud.
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And I pointed out that, even if you want to label Sharon in such a
way, he is an elected official who will soon be gone;
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That argument has some merit; I just can’t remember you ever using it
until today(?). Is any living man responsible for the murder of more
civilians than Sharon?
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the true criminal and fraud
otherwise known as Arafat remains.
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Only one of these two criminals gets tea and scones at the Whitehouse.
;)
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Further, to blame Israel for lashing out against those who support,
fund, aide, assist, and man terrorism against her is quite ignorant
to say the least.
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Israel is entitled to defend itself within the limits of international
law. That does not cover land theft, indiscriminate use of force,
murder of civilians, murder of journalists, murder of UN officials,
murder of peace activists, contamination of water supplies, destruction
of wastewater treatment plants, etc.
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The Palestinians would be history if they perped that kind of
behavior against the US. Ask any Taliban leader or SH himself.
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lol. Don’t be a complete fool; are the Afghans “history” now? What about the
Iraqi’s; are they “history” also?
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Israel uses a text which a great many people view as at least partly
fictional to justify the theft of land and the oppression of
millions.
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Blah blah blah. Want to talk about right of return for Jews in
“Palestine”? Please.
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Relivance?
If you have a point, please make it. Before you do, what is the
theological explanation for the demise of historical Israel?
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None
of that suggests “restraint” to me.
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They still exist. This is restraint.
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You really do worry me John.
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Read this from AI: A pregnant woman trying to reach hospital in
Bethlehem on 2 April was reported to have been stopped at an Israeli
checkpoint where she subsequently gave birth. Her baby died. I
understand there have been around 50 such infant deaths since the
current violence started. Does that suggest restraint to you?
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How many Palestinians are saved each year in Israeli hospitals due
to Palestinian homicide bombers???? You disingenuous hack!
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Does firing rockets into crowd from a helicopter gunship suggest
restraint to you?
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They still exist. This is restraint.
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Does attacking its neighbors suggest restraint to you?
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They still exist. This is restraint.
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Does demolishing homes with people still in them suggest restraint
to you?
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They still exist. This is restraint.
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Your argument is specious. Does the fact that people escaped from the
twin towers mean the perpetrators have shown “restraint”? I think not!
You appear to be saying that anything other than the extermination of
the Palestinian people is “restraint”! You also appear do be saying
that is something the United States of America would be willing to do; that is
complete garbage!
Being a Palestinian does not mean someone is a terrorist.
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You need to open your mind.
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If both sides used less violence and showed more understanding I
think we’d be closer to peace. The answer is not total war.
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HELLO, SCOTT!!!! PULL YOUR HEAD OUT OF THE SAND! IT WON’T HAPPEN!
How stupid and naive can one possibly be???? But you keep wishing
for world peace in your ivory tower; it’s so much more sophisticated.
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Why won’t it happen? Because both sides are locked into this cycle of
violence? Because extremists on both sides want it all their own way? Because
the funding Sharon gets from Bush means he can afford to continue the conflict?
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The conflict could have easily been ended as far back as in 1967
after the victory in the 6 Day War.
WWI is a classic example illustrating my point. There was no
resounding victory that ended WWI; peace was not achieved by force,
but by negotiation. This false peace, of course, led to WWII,
which was ended by force and has lasted.
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No response?
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After or before your squirming below?
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I guess I should have clarified: when I said “force”, I meant a
kind of force that dictates unconditional surrender.
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“Civilized nations” (or “Presidents”) do not continue (or start) a
war when there is a non-violent alternative.
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Cites please.
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You want me to cite a war which has not happened? Shall I also list all the
cigarettes I did not smoke today (I’m a non-smoker)?
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The “understanding” comes after victory is achieved so that the
defeated country is treated in such a way so as to insure effective
assimilation back into the world of civilized nations.
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Your comment implies that the good guy always wins... just like in
the fairy tales.
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Who lives in fantasy land??? Me, the realist,
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You’re not a realist, you are irrational.
or you, the one who wants
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everyone to just hold hands and understand each other?? This is the
biggest pile of BS solution I have ever heard! It will never happen
on a little place I like to call earth.
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I’m being pragmatic. If I were an idealist (which is what you are
trying to say) I’d want Israel to return to its original borders.
Realistically, I realise that is not going to happen. I think the
Palestinians would settle for the 67 borders; Sharon would never give
them that even if peace were GUARANTEED! I expect you’d support him?
Scott A
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