Subject:
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Re: From Reason: "It's all bad news - Chaos in occupied Iraq"
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Tue, 25 May 2004 15:44:51 GMT
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Viewed:
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1095 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
From its very pages:
Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, a spokesman for the occupation forces, estimated
that there were a total of 3,000 to 5,000 guerrilla fighters in Iraq, with
5 to 10 percent of those coming from outside the country.
Since when did 5 to 10% = “most”?
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They are the ones who keep blowing themselves up and wreaking all of the
havoc-- exactly what al-qaeda wants (not Iraq)
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The resistance in Iraq is coming primarily from outside Iraq, not in.
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Like those folks at that wedding?
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Won’t dignify that smart-ass remark with a repl.....uh, nevermind.
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Bush’s spin: “This is one of the routes we have watched for a long time as a
place where foreign fighters and smugglers go.”
The reality:
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(snipped)
Is this where I reply by posting a link to the Nick Berg slaughter? You are
being a jerk.
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Bush’s inability to admit fault is further radicalisimg opinion in the
region and thus increasing the “threat” to us all.
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So, 9-11 was Bush’s fault? Whose fault was it, then?
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As
Friedman says, it is better to address this threat early outside of US
borders before it reaches us.
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...Bush is increasing the threat; don’t doubt that!
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How do you increase a threat as large as the 9-11 attack?
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The 9-11(R) attack was not a threat.
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Don’t be daft! I am talking about another attack that would be
“increased” (your words)
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I think Bush
overreacted to decrease that threat, if anything.
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The main source of concern pre 911 was US support for the Saudi’s and
Israel.
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And obviously, that concern was vastly inadequate given the events of 9-11.
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Bush has made that list much longer! Bush only reacts to the symptoms; not
the causes. I can’t think of any real effort he has made to target what
drives the “evil doers”.
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Listen to me, Scott, because I’m sick and tired of “going there” over this
issue. The motivation of the terrorists is not our concern. We can’t stop
sick minds from thinking evil. Do you even know what the terrorists
want???? Do you? What do they want, Scott? Even if America pulls every
single American back to the US and never steps foot outside of her borders,
do you think that would make them happy? This isn’t about poverty or
suffering of the poor or any other social issue you want to envoke. It is
about religious fanaticism-- psychotic, inhuman, and irrational. There is no
“dealing” with that.
Try to get this through your thick skull: they want everybody (not just the
US) either to become one of them or die. That’s it. What did you ever do
to these people? And yet read this:
http://dennisprager.com/destroyengland.html
I read that I am simply dumbfounded. That is what we are up against.
JOHN
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You may think that Scotts missing your point, but the point you seem to be
oblivious to is that the actions undertaken by this US administration isn’t
helpful to reducing or eliminating the terrorist threats.
It’s like this--
If ‘the people’ are content--there’s food and water (no starvation), there’s
infrastructure to maintain jobs and leisure activities--basically ‘the people’
are content with their lives, it would be much more difficult to incite ‘the
people’ to commit terrorist acts. To be said, in this little hypothetical,
there will always be those individuals, like Koresh, who, while being
charismatic, have a slightly tainted outlook on their society and may end up
committing ‘acts against society’. But in a contented society, the Koreshes
should be few and far between.
On the other hand, as history *blatantly* shows us, you bomb a civilization, you
murder wives, children, and whoever stands in your way, especially for flawed
reasoning, you will incite people to rise against you--What PB said in satire I
say in earnest “you killed my father--prepare to die!”
Do I like that? Does this justify the actions of terrorists? No. My lack of
appreciation of terrorists does in no way diminish human nature, however.
This ill-conceived and unjustified war of the US administration is inciting more
people to commit what the administration is deeming ‘terrorist actions’ against
the troops in Iraq. It’s a ‘text book’ case, and you are oblivious to it.
Maybe the Iraqi ‘insurgents’ are attempting to defend their homeland from a
foreign aggressor? At least, that’s a possibility of some of these
‘insurgents’. Maybe they think of themselves a ‘freedom fighters’. But you’d
be oblivious to such a thought because your idea is right, just, and ‘God
Ordained’, and they’re just wrong.
If you unjustifiably punch someone and cry ‘foul’ when they attempt to punch
back, well, I’ve used the word ‘oblivious’ before...
Dave K
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Message has 3 Replies:
 | | What's a freedom fighter?
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| (...) I know, I know. I promised myself I'd try to stay away from .debate. But this freedom fighter thing got me thinking. What's a freedom fighter? Who gets to decide? Were the IRA ever called freedom fighters? How are they generally perceived in (...) (20 years ago, 25-May-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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