Subject:
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Re: The Brick Testament parts the Red Sea
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:30:19 GMT
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Viewed:
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2012 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> >
> > > > Believing that the God of the Hebrew Bible sent his son to Earth in the form
> > > > of a human male 2,000 years ago to "save" us from our sins sounds very much
> > > > like it is incompatible with other religions' theologies, and not at all
> > > > independent of them.
> > >
> > > It is unique, and it has a unique message.
> >
> > There are any number of self-contradictory assertions inherent in the
> > Christian faith with which one could take issue, but this is the big one that
> > needs to be exorcised whenever it's uttered. The whole
> > God-incarnate-here-to-redeem-us theme is not at all distinct to Christian
> > mythology, and in fact occurred numerous times in history prior to Christ,
> > quite a few times contemporaneously, and a bunch of times since then. To
> > assert that there is anything grand or divine or unique or special about the
> > alleged divinity, death, and alleged resurrection of Christ is simply to ignore
> > reality.
> > I can assemble a list of other divine incarnations if you'd like, but I don't
> > have all of the necessary citations in front of me, so it'll take a little
> > while. In any case, it is futile to hang one's faith on claims of uniquely
> > manifested divinity.
>
> I would like to see your cites. Christianity offers a few unique twists. One
> which I believe is unique is the "fully human, fully divine" status of Jesus,
Socrates was, for example, a Son of God, though I understand that that's not
quite what you meant. (Socrates was more moral than Jesus, however).
Off the top of my head the other big one I can think of is Appollonius of
Tyre, whose name I may have misspelled, but who lived around 90 AD and was
believed by his disciples to be god-made-flesh in fulfillment of prophesy.
I'll have to look up a few others.
> and his fulfillment of OT biblical prophesy.
This criterion is irrelevant, since those prophesies are hopelessly vague and
since their only "confirmation" comes from authors writing after them and in
full awareness of them. Such confirmation is invalidated by the inherent
conflict of interest.
> I also am not aware of any
> God-incarnate myths that came to forgive sins, or that came to earth *humbled*.
I believe there are a few Greco-Roman myths, and I also think that
Appollonius fulfilled that role.
> And since I used the active-indicative in my assertion, have you any cites of
> *current* examples?
Not sure what you mean--are you referring to "current examples" of religions
that survived two millennia of Christian purges? That's like asking me to show
you a live dodo bird and then claiming that no live dodo birds ever existed.
Or am I misreading you?
More later...
Dave!
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: The Brick Testament parts the Red Sea
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| (...) Well, I had the spelling wrong, and the attribution. The name I was aiming for is Apollonius of Tyana. And here are a few others: Pythagoras (who could bilocate, by the way) Simon Ben Kochba Empedocles Shabbetai Tzevi Orpheus Simon Magus Sun (...) (22 years ago, 2-Dec-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: The Brick Testament parts the Red Sea
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| (...) I would like to see your cites. Christianity offers a few unique twists. One which I believe is unique is the "fully human, fully divine" status of Jesus, and his fulfillment of OT biblical prophesy. I also am not aware of any God-incarnate (...) (22 years ago, 2-Dec-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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