| |
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Christopher L. Weeks writes:
> David, I get your stance on the commandment now. They aren't actually laws
> that God passed down about how to live your life. They're just good ideas.
> I'm pretty sure that's not how most Christians would characterize them, but
> that's really neither here nor their.
>
> But you did say that nailing your neighbor's wife is _immoral_. Not just
> unwise, not potentially fraught with long term adverse affects, and not just
> yucky to your personal aesthetic. You said immoral. And you asserted moral
> absolutes. So I'd appreciate a clarification on your part.
>
> Is adultery universally immoral? If so, in what sense, and what do you think
> morality means?
>
> So I've written this instead of a point by point, but I want to do a little
> response to select bits below. This isn't about morality, but it is about sex:
>
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Koudys writes:
>
> > Forgetting STD,s 'n such, how can you keep the
> > concept that if you and your wife are 'swapping' that she won't find a
> > better physical lover than you?
>
> Wouldn't it be great if she did? She would have found a way to more fully
> experience joy. I love my wife very deeply, so why would I want to hold her
> back from that?
>
> > she may think perhaps you're doing someone on the
> > side, that she doesn't know about.
>
> Why would she think that? My wife and I don't lie to one another. We have
> more trust than I have ever experienced in any kind of relationship. Lying is
> simply not needed.
>
> > I mean, you've opened up a Pandoras Box of emotional issues.
>
> It feels like that for a while, but when you get used to the idea it all fades
> away and feels like you were silly before.
>
> > How can you feel committed to one another wholely and
> > completely, when you're sleeping with other people?
>
> What do the two have to do with one another? And I guess honestly, I'm not
> "committed...wholely and completely" to my wife. I have kids to care for, a
> job, hobbies, dreams, etc. I share my committment among them all. I'll tell
> you one thing though, coming to the realization that my love is not some
> limited resource to be hoarded and carefully doled out only in return for
> payment or reciprocation, has been a powerful revelation. This I say: Love all
> you want, we'll make more!
>
> Chris
Love is limitless, 'cause, for me it comes from a limitless God, but that's
neither here nor there.
If it feels good, do it, is a claim of moral reletivism. I know that it's
too simplistic, so lets dispense with that 'cause I think we all agree that
having that as a driving force in your life could lead to all sorts of things.
Let's talk about my idea of moral absolutes and how they apply to my
life--no one else's, just mine, for that is what I am saying--you can do
whatever you want as long as you have negligible impact on me-- but I
mentioned that many many times and I digress (nothing new...)
My moral absolutes come from what can be best described as 'russian
roulette' philosophy--I can either play and hope I 'dodge the bullet', or I
can not play at all. For me, weighing what is 'won' by playing, i.e.
instant gratification of banging your neighbours wife, against what can
potentially be lost, i.e. your marriage, is no contest. It's much like
smoking and drinking and driving--you can 'get away' with it your entire
life--no one else is stopping you, but why shouldn't *I* drink and drive?
Why shouldn't *I* smoke? Why shouldn't *I* try swapping? They all have
pleasurable aspects (well, 'xept the drinking and driving), they all are
'legal' (again 'xept the d&d, so drop that point), but why don't I?
Because, rationally, logically, everytime I take a drag, and everytime I
boff my neighbours wife, I run a risk, a risk that does not come close to
justifying the rewards.
No one can say to me that sleeping around has *no* consequenses, and even if
we rationalize it with 'Well, it's okay for all parties involved and we're
all virus free', we still cannot rationailize the impact of this lifestyle
over the course of our lives. Do we know how we're going to 'feel' when
we're 60? Are we 'better' people for sleeping around compared to those that
stayed in a faithful relationship?
I do not deny you the right to sleep around, i deny it's a 'better' option
than mine of, well, not. I don't look down on people who sleep around, nor
do I *judge* them. Some of my best friends like lotsa lotsa sex and they
love telling the rest of us about their night before over coffee time
Saturday morning (for some strange reason). Whatever, it's your life
choices, not mine.
The number one cause of broken? More than all the rest combined? 'He (or
she) cheated on me.' Yes then it's *not* consenting by all parties, but
just 'cause you can keep your willy in your pants unless your wife gives you
the 'go ahead', well, whatever... Dodging bullets. That's moral relativism.
Teenage pregnancy, abortion issues, VD, STD's--moral relativism. I'm here
to help where I can. Safe sex is a myth like the easter bunny and, what's
more, everyone knows it--hence we now call it 'safer' sex. Y'know how *not*
to get pregnant, wholeheartedly fer sure with no worries? Ahh, not having
sex. Teach that to your kids along side the pill and condoms. I know I
will be mentioning it to mine.
My moral absolutes say, 'I'm gonna avoid even pulling the trigger and
standing in front of the bullet.'
This is why I don't smoke
This is why I don't do drugs
This is why I don't sleep around, even if it's said to be okay by consenting
adults.
This is why I dont drink and drive. Well, I don't drink at all--I drive
lots, though--that's one bullet I keep standing in front of.
Can you imagine if, in this hypothetical world, say, somewhere down the
road, one of these women i slept with came knocking on my door with child in
tow? Well, I'm sure I'd love the child, but it shows that there are
consequenses, there are ramifications way down the road that we don't even
know about yet. None of this has *anything* to do with Christianity and God.
Do I think I'm 'above' anyone, due to my 'moral superiority'? Well, no,
'cause I don't think my morals are any better than anyone else's. I don't
think they're any worse, either, btw.
Do I deny myself pleasure? Nope. Do I hoard it thinking I have only this
limited cupful? Nope. That's how I can 'be there' for whomever needs a
helping hand and just be the nice guy that I am (if I do say so myself :) ).
Anyway, I hope I've made my moral absolutes that apply to *my* life alone as
clear as I possibly can.
Dave K
|
|
Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: slight
|
| (...) Not only do I think "if it feels good, do it" is a grand philosophy, I think it's the only philosophy. It's the one that we all follow every day, every time we make any kind of decision. You make the assumption that it must be short-sighted, (...) (22 years ago, 16-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: slight
|
| David, I get your stance on the commandment now. They aren't actually laws that God passed down about how to live your life. They're just good ideas. I'm pretty sure that's not how most Christians would characterize them, but that's really neither (...) (22 years ago, 16-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
225 Messages in This Thread:
(Inline display suppressed due to large size. Click Dots below to view.)
- Entire Thread on One Page:
- Nested:
All | Brief | Compact | Dots
Linear:
All | Brief | Compact
This Message and its Replies on One Page:
- Nested:
All | Brief | Compact | Dots
Linear:
All | Brief | Compact
|
|
|
|
