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> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Richard Marchetti writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> > I think it's irrelevant who started it. The incarnation of God is a pretty
> > special event, to say the least. To argue that it is somehow wrong to
> > celebrate Jesus' birth without a written command to do so is specious.
> It could be seen as a kind of idolatry.
You've lost me. To what idol are you referring?
> But it also suggests that your
> faith is whatever you think it should be. I am not seeing any citations or
> authorities for the practice of either Xmas or Easter here, John.
> > Sorry. *THAT* is considered a direct command from Jesus:
> As performed during a Passover rite. That is all that is stipulated. If
> you do something else with it, that might be a deviation from the teachings
> of Jesus. Why would you do that?
Jesus Himself deviates from the Passover rite. He instituted a new one during
the old one (the oldest rite that is still observed today, AFAIK). Jesus *IS*
the pascal lamb. The blood of Jesus will save now. He is the fulfillment of
Passover.
> > Jesus gave to us the new covenant.
> Jesus said he didn't come to change the law, but to fulfill the law. What
> new covenant?
The hope for the Messiah is the hope and prayer of the Jewish Bible. When the
Messiah comes, all will be fulfilled. The OT is about how to be right with God
through God providing the Law (Torah)-- Jesus' coming now makes everyone right
with God *without* need of the Law-- He has redeemed the world. This is the
new covenant-- the saving grace of Jesus the Christ.
He didn't change the Law per se, He fulfilled it, rendering it useless. There
is no more use for the Law because of our reconciliation to God through the
redemptive actions of Jesus. We don't *need* the Law to be right with God now.
*This* is the new covenant through Jesus Christ.
> > They may be celebrated concurrently with pagan rites, but they have nothing
> > to do with them.
> That's just doubletalk. They are pagan rites appropriated by Xtians and
> condemned in the bible. Show me authorities for your views on this, O great
> messenger.
First explain to me the pagan rites to which you are referring, because I
really don't know what you're talking about.
> You're not one of these "under grace" losers are you?
eh, I'm not sure, because, again, I don't know what you're talking about.
> That's basically an
> admission that you don't care about the letter of the bible.
"letter of the bible"? Clarify.
> Which in turn
> means there is no authority for your views. You are a law unto yourself,
> which is fine -- but just please admit this important point.
Just clarify what you mean and I'll respond.
> > God raised Jesus from the dead. As I have mentioned elsewhere, the nature
> > of Jesus is very complicated. But if you are wondering whether or not I
> > believe He has authority, well then, yes I believe He does.
> So why don't you do the things he said you should do, and why do you do
> things he never mentioned at all?
You'll have to be specific. Are you referring to His teachings? Rituals?
> BTW, if you're not actually going to answer my questions, then what's the
> point of talking about it, O great messenger? These half answers aren't
> very persuasive. You're blowing your big chance to score for the Big Man
> upstairs.
These half questions aren't very intelligible-- as in half the time I can't
even understand what you're asking.
-John
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: slight
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| (...) [note: I have no idea what the "Christian Churches of God" are or what they may or may not believe in addition to the stuff referenced below (it wouldn't surprise me to discover they were a white supremacist christian identity movement, many (...) (22 years ago, 12-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: slight
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| (...) It could be seen as a kind of idolatry. But it also suggests that your faith is whatever you think it should be. I am not seeing any citations or authorities for the practice of either Xmas or Easter here, John. (...) As performed during a (...) (22 years ago, 12-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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