Subject:
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What is insurance? (was Re: Rights to free goods? (was Re: What happened?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Thu, 8 Jul 1999 02:45:46 GMT
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Reply-To:
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LPIENIAZEK@NOVERA.COMavoidspam
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Viewed:
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1128 times
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Ed Jones wrote:
>
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> > Ed Jones wrote:
>
>
> > You're stretching here, you know. This notion that you paid in advance
> > for food stamps and therefore are entitled to get them kind of runs
> > counter to the notion that the needy deserve help whether they paid for
> > it or not. You can't have it both ways. You do know that, right?
>
> Actually, you can,
No, you cannot have your cake and eat it too. That violates causality.
No, you cannot make two opposing/conflicting arguments at the same time.
That violates logic. That's what you're trying to do. So you cannot have
it both ways.
> and it was the intent of the original program - to assist
> those with no income and to assist those who are underemployeed.
Agreed. That was the intent. So let's stop calling it insurance, because
that's not what it is. It's assistance, that is, wealth transfer.
See: http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=insurance
In the very first paragraph it speaks to the notion of paying a premium
and the notion of a policy. Show me the policy. Show me how a food stamp
recipient who has always qualified for earned income credit (and thus
always paid negative tax) paid a premium. Show me how to choose not to
buy this insurance.
Of course, if we change "unemployment insurance" to "wealth transfer
from employers to the currently unemployed" it won't have nearly the
popular support, will it? Did you know there are a number of programs
and taxes that employers pay that do not show on your earnings
statement? The government doesn't want you thinking about whether you'd
rather your employer spent the money on sprucing up the lunchroom, or
paying you more instead of paying a secret tax. (1)
But as I said in a different append, we're mixing up today with
tomorrow. Tomorrow's world will feature unemployment insurance that
actually is an insurance, sold by companies who actually will be in
business to make a profit, with the premiums either paid explicitly by
employers (and thus a benefit used to compete for workers) or employees.
> > Your argument is analogous to a mugger asking me after he robs me
> > whether I'd rather he spent my money on whiskey or whores, and somehow
> > feeling that means he didn't actually rob me. (2)
>
> Ya lost me with that analogy.
OK, you're saying that because you are, in some combination of future
circumstances, possibly going to be entitled to some benefit or another,
it's OK that we come and make you pay in advance for that one and a
bunch of others, and because we're going to maybe pay you later, we're
not actually robbing you now. And we'll even let you choose whether to
apply for the benefit or not.
Now do you see the analogy?
> What, you did't read my request to Todd for spell a spell checker for
> LUGNET?
I did. Fully support that one. Even a stopped clock has a good idea once
in a while. Or something like that.
PS your doors arrived safe and sound. Thanks.
1 - Here's a radical thought. Ever heard of Taxation without
Representation? I'm not a big supporter of corporations, but don't
corporations pay a lot of taxes? Where do they get to cast their vote,
exactly?
--
Larry Pieniazek larryp@novera.com http://my.voyager.net/lar
- - - Web Application Integration! http://www.novera.com
fund Lugnet(tm): http://www.ebates.com/ Member ref: lar, 1/2 $$ to
lugnet.
NOTE: I have left CTP, effective 18 June 99, and my CTP email
will not work after then. Please switch to my Novera ID.
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