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In lugnet.loc.us.me, Eric Joslin writes:
> In lugnet.loc.us.me, Eric Kingsley writes:
>
> > I do believe however that if we participate in public events like Mindfest in
> > the future or even sponsor our own events then it might be nice to let <18
> > participate.
>
> How do you mean? Do you mean participate as in attend the event and see our
> models, talk to and meet us, and so on, or do you mean participate as in bring
> models of their own and be there as a part of NELUG? The former isn't a
> problem, at that point we're just publicising the event, which is good for
> everyone. The latter brings us back to all those legal issues we were dealing
> with before. Imagine this situation: Someone <18 hears NELUG will be at an
> event, and he is allowed to participate. He brings a model to display, chats
> with event attendees, etc. Now he is off looking at something else, and
> there's an accident. A monitor falls down and breaks. Owner wants money.
> Kid was part of NELUG.
>
> I realise it's more than a bit of a grey area, but since I don't think anyone
> would find straightening out legal stuff like this to be fun, it's probably
> better to just avoid them completely.
Again I think you are right. As far as events like Mindfest etc. I would
think it would be more of a "come see our exhibit" type thing then a "be part
of NELUG and display your creations". First of all if it were something like
Mindfest where space was limited we would not want a gazillion models just
because we pretty much didn't have enough room with what we had and we had one
of the biggest set up there. Besides with Mindfest just about anyone that
attended could have reserved a table and I guess that is what I would suggest
non-NELUGer's should do.
And by "avoid them completely" I assume you mean the issues rather than the
people. Again that is definitly one way to go and probably the best way to go
for meetings etc. and dealing with all the legal issues is not why I got in
this in the first place.
>
> > I also think that it might be OK to let <18 get on our mailing
> > list with their parents permission and their understanding that there are
> > rules for using the mailing list that they have to follow.
>
> Well, this clearly isn't a problem. I wouldn't think. We make sure part of
> the user agreement is that people don't use "strong" language or inappropriate
> behaviour, and we're all set. Of course, at that point they might as well be
> reading LUGNET. Especially since so far, everything that would be of use to
> someone who wants information but can't attend meetings or be an active
> NELUGger has been posted here.
>
> Maybe a second mailing list? I mean, part of the problem is that so far the
> mailing list's niche has been for discussing stuff that we *only* want members
> to see, like stuff about deciding whether we should go to Mindfest, and other
> things that we, um, haven't done and would probably be inappropriate to bring
> up here.
I like your idea of a second list. If someone like Ryan or another JrFOL were
interested in having meetings of their own we could definitly look into setting
them up with a mailing list like ours that is used to distribute information
that should not be posted publicly like addresses, phone #'s, directions to
ones house etc.
Just so you all know the mailing list is not some sort of "secret society" type
of information exchange where we hide things from the general community. It
really is not that exciting for the most part we only use it in the last stages
of setting up a meeting and Addresses, Phone #'s, and Directions have to be
given to the group. There have been rare occasions when we have used the list
for NELUG only decisions but really those discussions weren't all that exciting
either.
In general if you read the local LUGNET groups and follow discussions there
then you pretty much see everything that is happening and being discussed.
> > The real issue for me in all this, that has been brought up before, is what
> > about those <18 year olds that are not quite adults but they don't really
> > have friends that build/play/create with LEGO anymore. This is similar to
> > Ryan's situation. I would really like to support these "young adults" in
> > some way so that they don't have to have a 13 year dark age like I did. My
> > problem is I don't know how to handle this other than to include them on the
> > mailing list and invite them to our "public" events. Maybe we can do
> > something like have a cookout once a year that we can invite JrFOLs and their
> > parents to.
>
> We can certainly support Ryan and whomever else out there might want to start
> an organisation for LEGO fans that are <18. We can also have events that they
> can attend.
>
> > I think the more we can try to do to help young adults like Ryan keep their
> > interest in LEGO until they are 18 the better. Then once they turn 18 they
> > can become full fledged members and valuable contributors to our meetings as
> > AFOL's.
>
> You're absolutely right. I do beleive in supporting LEGO as a hobby for
> people of all ages (literally), I just don't think that NELUG would be as much
> fun if we had the extra headaches that would inevitably come with <18 members.
Well I would like to keep this discussion open for a while. I think we have
come up with a couple of good comprimises. I also don't want Ryan or any other
JrFOL to feel like we want nothing to do with you. That is the farthest thing
from the truth it is just that legal issues can be overwhelming when it comes
to minors which you may or may not understand. I think we can work towards
some inclusion but just not complete inclusion. I guess that may sound a bit
harsh but there are times when adults want to be able to be with adults and not
have to worry about every word they say or every action they take.
So at this point I would really like to look at this discussion as a comprimise
to see what we as Adults can do for the JrFOL community without exposing
ourselves to undo legal risk.
From what I have heard so far these are the types of things where JrFOLs can
participate.
1. Mailing list (either as part of our own or as a separate list)
2. Invite JrFOLs to public events.
3. Possibly have an annual cookout or other event where JrFOLs are welcome to
come with their parents.
4. Support Ryan and other like him who are not kids anymore but arn't quite
adults either in their LEGO endevors. (This needs more discussion for sure)
Again please chime in whether you are an AFOL or an interested JrFOL. Either
way your input is quite valuable in this somewhat sensitive subject.
Eric
The New England LEGO Users Group
http://www.nelug.org/
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