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In lugnet.admin.general, carbon60@bigfoot.com (Carbon 60) writes:
> [...]
> If all of us in lugnet.loc.uk agree with this proposal then it stands a good
> chance of being accepted. I know many of you want all of the smaller groups
> scrapped, Todd doesn't want this so this is a good compromise and will cover
> all future expansion - there will never be that many of us.
> [...]
Simon & Richard, this looks really nice. Thanks for all the effort you put
in and research time you devoted.
I have a bunch of questions and a counter-proposal.
> lugnet.loc.uk
> lugnet.loc.uk.wl Wales
> lugnet.loc.uk.sc Scotland
> lugnet.loc.uk.ni Northern Ireland
>
> English regions, a discussion on the future of lugnet.loc.uk.en needs to be
> considered as these regions would be on the same Goverment hiearchy as
> Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and so there would be useless duplication.
> The idea of an English Parliament has been ruled out.
The 9 groups listed below are areas of specifically England, right? Could
you elaborate on what you mean by "on the same Government hierarchy" and
"useless duplication"? I don't quite understand why they're on the same
hierarchical level as .uk.wl, .uk.sc, and .uk.ni. Do you mean that they're
less geographical and more administrative, and overlap multiple physical
areas of the Kingdom?
> lugnet.loc.uk.ne North East
> lugnet.loc.uk.nw North West
> lugnet.loc.uk.yk Yorkshire and the Humber
> lugnet.loc.uk.se South East
> lugnet.loc.uk.ea Eastern
> lugnet.loc.uk.lo London
> lugnet.loc.uk.em East Midlands
> lugnet.loc.uk.wm West Midlands
> lugnet.loc.uk.sw South West
Are the 9 suffixes above official or made-up for this?
> [...]
> In order to cover the entire British 'Empire' I propose the possibility of
> these groups - some of which were defined as their own country when they are
> still considered part of the UK.
>
> Complete list of all islands:
> lugnet.loc.uk.ai Anguilla
> lugnet.loc.uk.ac Ascension Island
AI and AC must be official historical abbreviations? I'd expect AI to mean
Ascension Island, not Anguilla. :)
> lugnet.loc.uk.bm Bermuda
> lugnet.loc.uk.vg British Virgin Islands
Bermuda and the Virgin Islands are already lugnet.loc.bm & lugnet.loc.vi, as
they have their own top-level Internet domains of .bm and .vi, respectively.
> lugnet.loc.uk.ky Cayman Islands
> lugnet.loc.uk.ci Channel Islands
> lugnet.loc.uk.fk Falkland Islands
> lugnet.loc.uk.gi Gibraltar
> lugnet.loc.uk.im Isle of Man
> lugnet.loc.uk.ms Montserrat
> lugnet.loc.uk.pn Pitcairn Islands
> lugnet.loc.uk.tc Turks and Caicos Islands
>
> In this proposal the total number of groups has been lowered but the local
> groups now cover all UK related places.
All right, first let's coalesce all of these into one list, first sorted by
newsgroup name:
lugnet.loc.uk
lugnet.loc.uk.ac Ascension Island
lugnet.loc.uk.ai Anguilla
lugnet.loc.uk.ci Channel Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.ea Eastern
lugnet.loc.uk.em East Midlands
lugnet.loc.uk.fk Falkland Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.gi Gibraltar
lugnet.loc.uk.im Isle of Man
lugnet.loc.uk.ky Cayman Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.lo London
lugnet.loc.uk.ms Montserrat
lugnet.loc.uk.ne North East
lugnet.loc.uk.ni Northern Ireland
lugnet.loc.uk.nw North West
lugnet.loc.uk.pn Pitcairn Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.sc Scotland
lugnet.loc.uk.se South East
lugnet.loc.uk.sw South West
lugnet.loc.uk.tc Turks & Caicos Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.wl Wales
lugnet.loc.uk.wm West Midlands
lugnet.loc.uk.yk Yorkshire & the Humber
The way North East and North West are separated in that view concerns me, as
well as (more importantly) the confusion of interspersing sub-regions of
England with sub-regions of the larger Kingdom.
Now here's how that would appear on http://www.lugnet.com/loc/uk/ ...
Local / United Kingdom /
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anguilla Falkland Islands North West Turks & Caicos Is.
Ascension Island Gibraltar Northern Ireland Wales
Cayman Islands Isle of Man Pitcairn Island West Midlands
Channel Islands London Scotland Yorkshire & Humber
Eastern Montserrat South East
East Midlands North East South West
Is it 100% clear to someone coming into that page out of the blue that, for
example, "North East" means Northeast England rather than Northeast UK? I'm
obviously not intimately familiar with how people think of UK regions on a
daily basis, so it's tough to judge whether the list above is single-layer
or mixed-layer, especially in the minds of viewers.
Is the following clearer or less clear?
Local / United Kingdom /
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anguilla England Montserrat Turks & Caicos Is.
Ascension Island Falkland Islands Northern Ireland Wales
Cayman Islands Gibraltar Pitcairn Islands
Channel Islands Isle of Man Scotland
Local / United Kingdom / England /
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eastern North East South West
East Midlands North West West Midlands
London South East Yorkshire & Humber
[End of questions segment]
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
[Now for the counter-proposal]
How about this (all 4 parts)?--
1) Scrap everything currently beneath:
lugnet.loc.uk.en.* (54 groups)
lugnet.loc.uk.ni.* (2 groups)
lugnet.loc.uk.sc.* (12 groups)
lugnet.loc.uk.wl.* (8 groups)
2) And keep:
lugnet.loc.uk
lugnet.loc.uk.ci Channel Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.en England
lugnet.loc.uk.im Isle of Man
lugnet.loc.uk.ni Northern Ireland
lugnet.loc.uk.sc Scotland
lugnet.loc.uk.wl Wales
3) And reserve for future expansion possibilities (these would go in
all together as a collection of subgroups someday):
lugnet.loc.uk.en.ea Eastern
lugnet.loc.uk.en.em East Midlands
lugnet.loc.uk.en.lo London
lugnet.loc.uk.en.ne North East
lugnet.loc.uk.en.nw North West
lugnet.loc.uk.en.se South East
lugnet.loc.uk.en.sw South West
lugnet.loc.uk.en.wm West Midlands
lugnet.loc.uk.en.yk Yorkshire & the Humber
Alternatively, if it made more sense if/when the time comes, the original
54 sub-groups of .loc.uk.en could be restored in place of creating these
9 new regional groups.
4) And reserve for spur-of-the-moment creation as appropriate (when needed),
so long as the areas (a) don't already have a top-level Internet domain
(like Bermuda & Virgin Islands or Hong Kong) and (b) aren't more logical
as a sub-category of some other .loc group:
lugnet.loc.uk.ai(ag?) Anguilla
lugnet.loc.uk.ac(ai?) Ascension Island
lugnet.loc.uk.ky(cy?) Cayman Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.fk(fi?) Falkland Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.gi(gb?) Gibraltar
lugnet.loc.uk.ms Montserrat
lugnet.loc.uk.pn(pi?) Pitcairn Islands
lugnet.loc.uk.tc Turks & Caicos Islands
That would leave the UK with 7 groups. And a plan for expansion.
It would mean the destruction of some existing content, but the number of
articles is small (around 10) since almost everything was posted to either
.loc.uk, .loc.uk.en, or .loc.uk.sc.
--Todd
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Message has 4 Replies:
Message is in Reply To:
 | | lugnet.loc.uk Restructuring Proposal
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| This proposal follows the proposal for a devolved Government in the United Kingdom, although the separate regions in England haven't been devolved yet they have been set up as Regional Development Agencies, a lot of research has been done by the (...) (25 years ago, 18-Jun-99, to lugnet.loc.uk, lugnet.admin.general)
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