 | | Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | Hi all, I've uploaded the power point presentation that I gave at BrickFest 2003. I is on this page: (URL) file is named pneumatics_magic.ppt. Enjoy! Kevin (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Thomas Avery
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| | | | | (...) Cool! Thanks for posting that. I enjoyed attending your presentation, although I admit I didn't fully understand all of it right then. I think some studying of the AND, OR, and the other type of OR (I forget what it's called- you can have one (...) (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Ross Crawford
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| | | | | | (...) That'd be XOR ;) And thanks Kevin for the PPT file, it's great! Although I do have one little query - on page 4, you say the cylinders "Expand faster than they contract" - is this correct? I thought it would be the other way round - they (...) (21 years ago, 16-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Lars Gjerløw Jørgensen
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| | | | | | | Ross Crawford's utterance expressed in news:HJovou.1wF6@lugnet.com: (...) Definately - with more presentations like this - a whole library of good knowledge can be made :) (...) you're right.. the volume to fill with air is smaller in the shaft-end (...) (21 years ago, 16-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | In lugnet.technic, Ross Crawford wrote: <snip> (...) Rosco, The expanding and contracting behavior is described by Pascal's law that says that the force exerted by a piston is the pressure (pounds per square inch) times the surface area (square (...) (21 years ago, 16-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Ross Crawford
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| | | | | | (...) Ummmm yep, thats what I meant - the contract side is smaller so less force, but wouldn't that also mean it contracts faster because it needs less air? Just like the small cylinders expand/contract much faster than the big ones because of the (...) (21 years ago, 18-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | In lugnet.technic, Ross Crawford wrote: <snip> (...) I think that the smaller pistons expand/contract faster because they have much less friction, combined with the fact that they have much smaller cavities. The old large single acting pistons (...) (21 years ago, 18-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Lars Gjerløw Jørgensen
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| | | | | | Kevin L. Clague's utterance expressed in news:HJsMzo.4n3@lugnet.com: (...) Friction is an important factor. But just as important is the fact that if I want to fill a certain volume with air, it takes less time if the volume is smaller - therefore (...) (21 years ago, 18-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) Yes. I've already acknowledged that they contract faster because of the smaller volume in a no load situation. (...) Kevin (21 years ago, 18-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Ross Crawford
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| | | | | | (...) Which was the basis of my original suggestion, that the smaller volume on the "contract" side of pistons (both large and small) would imply that they contract slightly faster than they expand, but with slightly less force? ROSCO (21 years ago, 18-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) Yes. The contract face of the piston has less area than the expand face. (...) Kevin (21 years ago, 19-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Ross Crawford
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| | | | | | (...) Whew! Glad we got that worked out! But that contradicts what you say in the PPT presentation, as I pointed out originally! (URL) (21 years ago, 20-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) update. That is what I love about LEGO, learning and discovery. I'm a computer engineer, not a physicist, and the things I make are highly physical. In this case, incomplete comprehension of the theory got in the way of practical (...) (21 years ago, 20-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Ross Crawford
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| | | | | | (...) Happy to play my part! (...) LOL! Well I'm sure I've heard of Pascal's Law, but didn't remeber the theory, it was just a "gut feeling" that it didn't seem right! (...) I've also been a bit worried about putting a big load on the contract (...) (21 years ago, 20-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) The biggest issue when fully expanded is leverage to the side which can lead to leakage. I've experienced it once in a while. Kevin (...) (21 years ago, 21-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Jennifer Clark
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| | | | | | "Kevin L. Clague" <kevin_clague@yahoo.com> wrote in message (...) lead to (...) Interesting, I've noticed this happens quite a lot when joing two large cylinders back to back to make a larger double cylinder, and some cylinders seem more prone to it (...) (21 years ago, 21-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Tim Auton
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| | | | | | (...) I sucked grease - by manually pulling the plunger with a dab of grease on the bottom air input - into my cylinders and they move more consistently and don't leak pressure. I used ceramic grease of the type you get for RC car gearboxes. They (...) (21 years ago, 21-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Tobbe Arnesson
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| | | | | | (...) Would not the grease eventually find it's way out into the hoses and make the hose connection a bad one because of the slippery grease? (21 years ago, 24-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Tim Auton
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| | | | | | (...) I've not encountered grease coming back out. It takes a really good tug to suck it in there and you don't get the same level of airflow when in normal use. The grease is fairly thick. After a bit of initial vigorous pumping by hand to spread (...) (21 years ago, 24-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Jennifer Clark
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| | | | | | "Tim Auton" <tim.lugnet@uton.org> wrote in message (...) I've just tried this and it does make a significant improvement, especially on older cylinders. With two old cylinders connected up in parallel, I found that the treated one would extend and (...) (21 years ago, 27-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Tim Auton
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| | | | | | "Jennifer Clark" <jen@vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk> wrote: [ceramic grease in pneumatic cylinders] (...) I hope there's no chance of damage :) I went for ceramic grease over organic as I understand it's fairly inert. I'm no chemist though and I don't (...) (21 years ago, 27-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Jennifer Clark
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| | | | | | "Tim Auton" <tim.lugnet@uton.org> wrote in message (...) It was ceramic grease I used as well, from Tamiya. It's still working today :-) (...) Excellent! Jennifer (21 years ago, 28-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Tobbe Arnesson
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| | | | | (...) Great, hope more will follow your example! (...) Note: File size is close to 30 MB! Most of it went above my head, it started out really basic but had a somewhat steep attack of things. Looks like it's tuned for computer programmers/designers (...) (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) Yes it is. It is all those pictures. (...) In the presentation, I talked about pneumatic pistons as actuators for things like back hoes, simulating the hyraulics that are often used in heavy machinery. I didn't spend time there because I think (...) (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kim Andersen
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| | | | | (...) Well, can't you take your own pictures off the 8455... ;-) Kim Andersen (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | | | (...) Well..... I didn't have the heart to cut up the hoses...... ;^) (...) Kevin (21 years ago, 15-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kim Andersen
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| | | | | | (...) That's why i have two... ;-) Kim Andersen (21 years ago, 16-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Mark Tarrabain
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| | | | (...) Hey Kevin! Welcome back. My own vanity had me curious to see how you would cover the 2 cylinder full adder I came up with, or how you would describe the procedure I use for hooking up the switches in "reverse", but I didn't see anything about (...) (21 years ago, 20-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Kevin L. Clague
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| | | | (...) Hi Mark, I didn't present your adder because it is yours to present. (...) I've found out that using the switches the way you do is how they were originaly used with the old lego pneumatics. (...) Kevin (21 years ago, 21-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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| | | | | | Re: Pneumatic Magic Presetnation Maertials —Mark Tarrabain
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| | | | (...) Ah... well given the unlikelihood that I'd ever be a lecturer at a future brickfest, I hadn't even considered that as a possibility. Not that I was expecting you to take credit for the idea, but more like "another guy I was chatting with on (...) (21 years ago, 21-Aug-03, to lugnet.technic, lugnet.robotics)
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