Subject:
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Re: From Harry Browne
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 8 Nov 2000 21:02:36 GMT
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Viewed:
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663 times
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(snippage of book suggestion, thanks, but I don't think we would have access to
a copy here in Newfoundland)
> > I would say that of the 2 countries which are freer with weapons (Swiss and
> > Israel), that it is _training_ that makes the difference.
>
> And you would say that why?
Because, just like the NRA says, guns don't kill people, people kill people.
A gun is as harmless as any other 10 lb object, at least until you put some
(un)thinking person behind the trigger of it. Access to weapons in both of the
above mentioned countries is dependent more on being qualified (sic) to use
them than on the amount of $$$ in your back pocket at a gun show, where your
ol'man's encouraging you to buy the latest/greatest gee wizz killing machine.
(ever seen the South Park episode where they go hunting???)
Don't get me wrong...I missed a chance this summer to bust about 900 caps, and
it would have been fun (but work related too...it was going to be a qual shoot,
which I have to do anyway, just a lot more ammo than usual)
In essence, we (Canadian Forces NCM's) are taught that: A-you point at it if
you want to kill it B-Point a weapon at someone (in the classroom) and you will
be doing LOTS of pushups until you get the point C-You _$@##$#$_ well secure
that rifle if you go _anywhere_, otherwise you will have the fun of a summary
conviction on your record.
>
> > It's not the body of people with guns, it is the fact that _every_ male has
> > served in the armed forces in some respect. Therefore, they have disipline,
>
> Yuck, yuck, yuck. I've known a whole passel of people who served in the US
> armed forces, and if anything, I think there is a negative correlation between
> service and clue, education, and discipline. Now, I'm not trying to dis you,
> or lots of other servicemen for whom that doesn't apply, but it's still my
> impression.
Perhaps I am in a naive world, since Canadians are supposedly worth about 1:5
to the US Army :).
There are some people who I would not choose to let loose with a gun, at least
not unless I had to. Right now, of the 10 people I work with every day, I'd
trust all 10 of them not to shoot themselves in the foot, or someone else
without thinking at least a little bit about it first. Do I doubt that there
are some servicemen/women who should not be allowed to carry a rifle? NO!
(snip)
> > but, I don't agree with the US style of no(practical) gun control at all
> > either.
>
> I wish that's what we really had. Actually, I think that the use and safety
> issues related to firearms should be mandatory public education topics.
>
> > I think that weapons which are designed to hunt people with (handguns,
> > assault rifles, fully auto weapons) are not something that you need to own
> > _under most circumstances_.
>
> I couldn't agree more. But, under the circumstances for which that's not
true,how do you get them? The citizens of the US have the right to own machine
guns, howitzers, tanks, etc so that if the gubmint gets upity, we can slap them
down. Now, if the gubmint gets upity enough that they need to be slapped down,
> and we don't already have those weapons, do you suppose that said uppity
> gubmint is going to just let us have them? Bzzzzzt!
Lets put it this way, how long would it take you to back off if I put 10 of
your friends against a wall for you attacking a 'government officer'. I am
well within my rights to do so (at least, by international law, and the actions
of the Americans in Germany and Vietnam).
Also, rest assured, as a tyrnical dictator, I would come up with some _really_
inventive ways to make it nasty for anyone caught with a weapon!.
The Spartan Rebellion is remembered for the cost of 300 dead...one every mile
to Rome.
(rest assured, I don't want to be a tyrnical (sp) dictator, but the point is
true)
> In the US the entire citizenry is the military and the police. So there is no
> such distinction between those groups and the public.
Do you _really_ think that "Red Dawn" was practical???
:)
The military takes more than just being a warm body. To be effective, it
requires tradition, and time. The day of the minuteman has passed, and had
passed by the end of the ACW.
James Powell
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: From Harry Browne
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| (...) to (...) As a grad student, I had to occasionally request inter-library loans internationally. It is no problem. (...) But virtually everyone over the age of twelve exhibits enough clue or discipline not to shoot people at random, or for petty (...) (24 years ago, 8-Nov-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: From Harry Browne
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| (...) I need to revise my statement above. The everywhere that I meant is limited mostly to the US. So maybe not quite everywhere, but it's good enough data from my POV. :-) If you're serious, start with _The Great American Gun Debate_ by Don B. (...) (24 years ago, 8-Nov-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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