Subject:
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Re: The Parable ot the Tortured Debtor
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:12:26 GMT
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Viewed:
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304 times
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I'm following up to o-t.debate not to be combative, just because I'm not really
discussing the MOC much.
In lugnet.build.ancient, Brendan Powell Smith wrote:
> In lugnet.build.ancient, Bruce Hietbrink wrote:
> > What a nice little surprise to finish the week.
>
> Yeah, I was happy to finish this one up a little ahead of schedule.
>
> > Title: Hmm, I probably would have chosen a different
> > title, as the torture is hardly the point, is it?
>
> It isn't?
>
> I could be wrong, but I thought this parable was one of the easier ones to
> "decode". The master in the story stands for God, and the slaves stand for
> humans. According to the parable, God forgives humans when they beg him to, and
> humans should follow God's example of forgiving those that beg them, because if
> you don't God will torure you.
>
> To me, the concept that God wants you to forgive people that beg you hardly
> seems novel, but the idea that he will torture you for non-compliance is new,
> important, and interesting info, so I assumed that this was the point Jesus was
> making.
I don't think it's the punishment that is the novelty here, but rather God's
forgiveness. At least the Xtian viewpoint is that Christ offered complete
forgiveness through his sacrifice, as opposed to constantly seeking forgiveness
through animal sacrifices and other atonements. The expected action of the king
would be to throw the debtor into prison, with ensuing torture. The unexpected
action is the willingess to forgive. The application is that accepting this
forgiveness also means going and acting in a forgiving manner: "Forgive us our
trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us."
> The only part I don't really get is what the "50 million silver pieces" stands
> for. Do humans owe God money? How'd that happen?
It's fairly common in various Xtian usage to use financial language when talking
about sin and atonement: "Forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors"
"Jesus paid the price" or "Christ ransomed our souls" etc. The symbolism is
simply that our sin against God (the 50,000,000 silver pieces) is much greater
than the small slights from other people (the 100 silver pieces).
> > believe that in Christian texts this is usually
> > called something like "Parable of the Unmerciful Servant".
>
> I don't always agree with the labels that have been attached to these stories by
> others. (In case anyone is not aware, the titles and headings you see in most
> Bibles today were added in much later and are not part of the original text of
> the scriptures.) Sometimes they're OK, but other times I find them very
> misguided or even repugnant.
One advantage of these common labels is that they form a type of shorthand
within Xtian circles. If you say "The Parable of the Unmerciful Servant" I know
immediately what you mean. If you say "that parable found in Matthew 18, verses
23 through 35", I'd have to get out my Bible and figure out which one you meant
(perhaps I should know it right away, I've just always been bad about memorizing
specific citations like that). I can see why these labels don't work as well to
someone who's not used to them.
> > I like the throne room a lot. Did you challenge yourself to
> > have a whole room with no studs-up orientation
> I was mostly interested in trying a floor pattern design using updide-down
> 1x1's, thinking that it might look neat.
It works well with the upside down arches, too.
> I just took another look at the throne, and it seems to
> be evenly colored, so it must be some trick of the light.
Also in Mt 18:31 the guard's helmet looks almost light purple on my monitor.
I'd think it was a new gray issue, but that element hasn't been produced in new
gray (AFAIK). I've seen odd lighting issues like this, too, where you move the
light source a few degrees and the colors come out very different in the photo.
Looking forward to the next parable.
Bruce
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: The Parable ot the Tortured Debtor
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| (...) That makes sense. (...) OK. I don't think I'll ever understand why killing an animal would incline God toward forgiveness. But even taking for granted that that system of atonement exists, I am further completely baffled as to how/why the act (...) (20 years ago, 21-Mar-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: The Parable ot the Tortured Debtor
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| (...) Yeah, I was happy to finish this one up a little ahead of schedule. (...) It isn't? I could be wrong, but I thought this parable was one of the easier ones to "decode". The master in the story stands for God, and the slaves stand for humans. (...) (20 years ago, 13-Mar-04, to lugnet.build.ancient)
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