Subject:
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Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:22:50 GMT
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Viewed:
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1085 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Mike Petrucelli wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Koudys wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Mike Petrucelli wrote:
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Even a Muskett in everyone’s hands would still work. The modern Military
can not defend itself from millions of people attacking them in their own
bases. (I honestly don’t understand why you have difficulty with this
concept.)
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And I don’t understand why you have a difficult time grasping the truth.
1776 history shows the differential in technology between the ruling powers
and the common man to be rather negligible. 2003, that differential is
exceedingly large.
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Maybe in Canada but not here in the U.S.
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Constant avoidance of the truth does not make the truth go away. A citizen
cannot purchase an F22. A citizen cannot have at his or her disposal an ICBM.
A citizen can only have, at best, a gun. This makes the differntial rather
large. It’s the truth of the matter, and, again, parenthetical, but still a
valid point. Giving everyone access to fighter jets and nuclear missles won’t
be the answer, either. A weapon in the hands of a citizen is a placebo (in
America), and won’t solve the problems facing your country. Guns are a large
contributing factor of the problems in your country. Larger weapons will just
equate to larger problems--i.e. more people dead or maimed.
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But that’s a rather parenthetical, though still valid,
point.
The real issue is that modern history has shown, in your very own
democracy, that the vote, or the ‘power of the people’ can remove people
from elected positions.
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The only thing that garuntees the right to vote is the armed citizenry.
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True in 1776, not so much today. Do you carry your sidearm to the voting booth?
Do you need to force someone to let you vote with the business end of a gun? I
reiterate, Nixon left, without one gun being shot, without one gun being
displayed, without *any* threatening action other than the power of the people.
It’s what happened and all your talk of guns had *nothing* to do with it.
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The gun wasn’t needed to oust Nixon. It’s how democracy works.
Reliance of guns equates to the power of terror, or tyranny. It’s truth,
and it’s one that Koresh didn’t learn, nor, at the rate you’re going,
neither will you.
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So
the couple million Americans who belong to ‘formally declared’ militia
groups (with no government ties except the knowledge they exist) which have
nearly equivelent weapons (machine guns, rocket launchers, etc.) would fair
very well. Now don’t get me wrong this is a last resort tactic to be sure,
but it is the only thing that backs up mere words. You may believe society
is above the concept of “survival of the fittest” but if you really take a
good look, its not.
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I believe in the evolution of society, to attain higher ideals for the
citizens of the society. There are countries in the world today that need
armed citizens just to make it thru their rough and meager existence--they
need their arms for protection and, hopefully, to overthrow their tyrannical
opressors. Your country (and mine) aren’t in that group.
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And won’t be so long as we retain the ability to combat such opressors.
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Yes, the armed forces will combat such oppressors. ‘Cause that’s what they’re
suppose to do. That’s what they’re trained for. That’s why you have taxes--to
pay for the educaiton and enhancement of your combat forces. Again, the truth
is your gun in your house does not contribute *in any fashion* to the protection
of your country. Guns in homes either do nothing, or are used against family
members, or are stolen to be used in crimes against your fellow citizen. These
are what your guns in your homes end up doing. Stop pseudo-rationalizing your
desire to retain a gun in your home. If you want to keep your gun, just say
that. I don’t care if oyu have a gun in your house--just be honest about it and
realize that, truthfully, it’s not there for all your ‘high falutin’ ideals’
‘cause you’re just deceiving yourself. You sound like a smoker rationalizing
his cancer stick. All the slick talking in the world isn’t going to change the
truth.
The kicker is that with all your talk you convince some people in the next
generation, and the ‘sins of the father’ are passed down to subsequent
generations, so they’ll beleive the same lies that you do, and again, they’ll be
faced with gun problems. It’s like any abusing situation--spouse abuse,
alcoholism--you sit there and rationalize it, and the kids see and hear it, and
they pick up on it. “This is the way it’s suppose to be!”
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Your gun in your house will not save your democracy if your democracy
deteriorates. Your vote, or the power of the people, will save your
democracy because, wait for it, that’s how democracy is suppose to work.
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So long as I am armed my vote can never be denied.
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So long as you are a citizen in a democracy your vote can never be denied. And
that, again, has nothing to do with a gun. “Hey Mike, we won’t let you vote in
this election!” “Yeah, I’ll just go get my gun and we’ll see about that!” Both
sides of that scenario are ludicrous, don’t you think?
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So lets go thru the reasons why you have a gun in your house:
Protection from criminals--not likely if the gun is properly locked up--the
criminal isn’t going to wait while you retrieve your gun and ammo and get it
all together
Protection from tyranny--Not likely due to the technology differntial
between the citizens and the establishment, no matter how you sugar coat
it--many of your 200 million fellow citizens do not own guns, and those that
do, many may not follow you on your ‘crusade’.
And if you don’t want a tyranny, then excercise your true power as American
citizens--the people.
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Where do you think that power comes from? The goodwill of the government?
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No, as stated, it comes from, well, the people. “We the people...” It didn’t
say “We the people who happen to own guns...” or “We the people who like
shooting at folks when things don’t go our way...” I don’t know every second of
every moment of MLK’s life, but from what I know, he never carried a gun and he
did more for your country than most anyone else in your history. Why? Because
he knew the power of the people--a fact that you seem to blatantly ignore so you
can hold on to your little security blanket. Security blankets are for 5 year
olds. Grow up and face the truth.
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How did a society that gaves us the likes of Martin Luther King, who
abhorred violence, also give us “outta my cold dead hands”?
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-Mike Petrucelli
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Dave K
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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| (...) However, fighter jets and ICBMs don't "hold" territory. Just look at what's going on in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Palestine for examples of what an "armed" citizenry might be able to do to resist oppressors. (...) Right now the situation is not (...) (21 years ago, 17-Sep-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Sticking my gun where it doesn't belong...
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| (...) Maybe in Canada but not here in the U.S. (...) The only thing that garuntees the right to vote is the armed citizenry. (...) And won't be so long as we retain the ability to combat such opressors. (...) So long as I am armed my vote can never (...) (21 years ago, 16-Sep-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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