Subject:
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Re: POV-RAY orange color
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:24:27 GMT
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Reply-To:
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(johnneal@uswest)nospam(.net)
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Viewed:
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1301 times
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Simon Robinson wrote:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
>
> <snip>
> > Now the story of Jesus is remarkable. Say anything you want, but you have
> > to admit that he is the most influencial human that ever lived. Why is
> > that? He was just a poor man living in a backward country in an ancient
> > world teaching a message for 3 lousy years and yet he has influenced the
> > lives of billions of people throughout history. It's because he was more
> > than just a man, and that his message was so profound.
>
> Saying that Jesus was the most influencial human that ever lived is IMO
> one of those statements that sounds reasonable at first, but doesn't really
> stand up to close analysis.
I see your point. It wasn't my intention to try to add veracity by saying
something like "that many people can't be wrong" I just meant that people still
talk about 1 man who lived 2000 years ago and follow his message. Why?
> Influencing people is a fairly vague thing: There are many things in our lives
> which influence us in different ways - and trying to break down what factors
> have caused us to do or believe what is almost impossible. Are all those
> Lego sets sitting in my room there because of sharing a house with
> Chris and seeing all his Lego? Or was it because of that time I was fooling
> around building models with Allie and then decided I enjoyed it so much
> I had to go out and buy another Lego set?
>
> Well, no, most likely it was a combination of hundreds of events, chance
> meetings
> and people, that turned me into an AFOL.
>
> Similarly, when asking why Christians believe what they do, is it really fair
> to
> attribute the influence entirely to Jesus, and thereby to neglect all those
> other people
> in history who passed the message on (and in many cases expanded or distorted
> the message in the process).
>
> The Bible directly records that - as a result of the teachings of Jesus,
> perhaps
> a few hundred people became 'believers'. That doesn't sound to me like
> the most influential person ever <grin>.It is as a result of what THOSE
> people,
> and others after them, did or said, that so many lives were influenced by
> Christianity.
Yes, of course it is the work of the body of believers who carry on the message
(Gospel). The key is that the Gospel has remained intact for two millennia and
not degenerated into garbage. (think of the game "telephone", where you start
with a one sentence message, and it gets whispered one by one down a row of
people. The message is not repeatable. Rarely does the message remain intact.
In fact, it gets butchered, and it's fun to see how:) This is because God's
Spirit is still active today, guiding and influencing. So even though God got
the ball rolling with a man on earth called Jesus, He continues to influence
through His Spirit.
> The fact that the story of Jesus has been made such a crucial
> part of the beliefs of those people does not *necessarily* imply that it was
> Jesus himself who was influential (though it doesn't disprove it either).
> You could argue that it was more the
> case that Jesus was made by other people into a figurehead.
Yes, but I think that without the continuing presence of God's Spirit, it would
have faded away long ago. I am amazed how short public consciousness is: It's a
"What have you done for me *lately*" mentality. Heck, even Moses had to deal
with it leading the People of Israel! "And there was murmuring..." I love that!
-John
>
>
>
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: POV-RAY orange color
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| (...) That's certainly a matter of interpretation. Were I more than normally interested in baiting you I'd say GIGO, but I won't. I will merely say that the Bible is not an easy read and that scholars do a great deal of debating about what errors (...) (25 years ago, 20-Aug-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: POV-RAY orange color
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| In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes: <snip> (...) Saying that Jesus was the most influencial human that ever lived is IMO one of those statements that sounds reasonable at first, but doesn't really stand up to close analysis. Influencing (...) (25 years ago, 20-Aug-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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