Subject:
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Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:29:45 GMT
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Viewed:
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5856 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Koudys writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Bruce Schlickbernd writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Maggie Cambron writes:
> > > No, of course not. Not for a country whose citizens voted George W. Bush into
> > > office.
> > >
> > > Maggie C.
> >
> > What country would that be?
> >
> > Bruce
> > (pointing out that the citizens of the U.S.A. rejected George Bush....)
>
>
> And yet, he's the prez...
And yet, my comment to Maggie still stands. :-)
>
> Don't ever say that the US *upholds* democracy above all else--a piece of
> paper trumped the will of the people.
To switch devil advocate sides: the piece of paper is the will of the
people. We can change it if we don't like it (political inertia may make it
difficult, but if we perceive it to be that big of a problem, I think that
could be overcome).
>
> And, from my vague recollections of poli-sci 101, the US isn't even a
> democracy, in its purest form--not even close. It combines Monarchy (the
> Prez), Aristocracy (the Senate), and a watered down form of Democracy (the
> House of Reps) I heard it called up here a voted Tyranny for 5 years (4
> years for our US neighbours) in which the people voted in can really do
> whatever they want for 4-5 years, until we kick them out of office the next
> time. Until that time, however, unless there are extraordinary factors,
> they're there in power, no matter what, a la Dubya.
The Tyranny of the Mob from ancient Greece wasn't exactly a recommendation
(you didn't just lose, sometimes they voted you dead). And I believe it is
termed a representative democracy. You directly vote for a representative,
and that representative votes in congress. The Senate is about the power of
individual states rather than the people per se.
>
> I remember a chart in poli-sci
>
> Benevolent Malevolent
> 1 ruler Monarchy Dictatorship
> Few Elite Rulers Aristocracy Oligarchy
> Rule of all People Democracy Democracy
Nothing really works well unless you empower somebody to make decisions.
Committees avoid responsiblity inherently. I suppose Pirate societies were
more of a democracy than the U.S. is, or perversely, the Swiss army during
the middle ages literally on the battlefield. But then, the U.S. doesn't
really claim to be a strict democracy, though it is founded with those
principles in mind.
>
> (Have no idea what that looks like with different fonts, but oh well, looks
> good with courier)
>
> THe part that I found interesting is that Democracy is in both columns, as
> in the 'Rule of the People' can be both good and/or bad.
As I noted: ancient Greece ("Excuse me, but we don't like your politics
anymore, here's a cup of hemlock").
>
> An old saying - a person is intelligent, people are stupid (look no farther
> than mob mentality)
>
> Anyway, enuf of my dusty memories about Political Science...
>
> Dave
My wife got her degree in poly-sci - I gotta hear it all the time (but does
she know what Chiarascurro is, or Trompe L'oiel? I can pull the snooty
artist routine as an ego-defense mechanism). :-)
Bruce
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