To LUGNET HomepageTo LUGNET News HomepageTo LUGNET Guide Homepage
 Help on Searching
 
Post new message to lugnet.off-topic.geekOpen lugnet.off-topic.geek in your NNTP NewsreaderTo LUGNET News Traffic PageSign In (Members)
 Off-Topic / Geek / 4868
4867  |  4869
Subject: 
Another LENNI Question (geek alert)
Newsgroups: 
lugnet.publish, lugnet.general, lugnet.off-topic.geek
Followup-To: 
lugnet.publish
Date: 
Thu, 9 Sep 2004 05:31:49 GMT
Viewed: 
55 times
  
Next techie question for LENNI… including semi-dynamic options for filters.

OK, now that I’ve gotten a pretty good idea of what to do with the LENNI spec (which should have a v0.2 draft this weekend), the one big question that is still bugging me is how to deal with content filters. Note: for this discussion, I’m calling “theme” = “interest” since it appears to be a wider filter at this point. See this thread about themes.

For the Audience one, it’s pretty simple to say in the spec it’s AFOL/KFOL/FOL/NYFOL or something like that. But for a category list that’s probably (make that definitely) going to need to be updated, how to deal with that? You don’t want to hard-code it into the actual application itself, since that way lies madness. Can you imagine a twice-yearly “Theme” update and making software developers update their products just for that?

I’d be more unpopular than a Bionicle fan at a Train club meeting. No wait, that really happened…

So there are several potential methods of describing how such a list could be maintained and still retain usability and flexibility. Here are a couple, please let me know if there’s anything obvious I’ve missed. Remember, this is based on RSS 2 /Atom 0.3, so it has to work with those formats.

First possibility: XSD, XML Schema Definition. I believe RSS 2.0 supports XSD, but I’m not absolutely sure. I know 0.92 doesn’t, and I’m staying as far away from RDF-centric RSS 1.0 as possible. Also, I think Atom can be extended to use XSD, but again, I’m not sure. Any clarification is helpful.

Like a DTD, an XSD can be an external document (hosted at the same place as the namespace, most likely) and is a validating document. But it doesn’t use the same syntax as DTDs do, which is nice since I’m too lazy (or busy) to learn them right now.

This page shows how to restrict a given value to a list of entries. For example, to define three car models:

<xs:element name=”car”>
<xs:simpleType>
<xs:restriction base=”xs:string”>
<xs:enumeration value=”Audi”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Golf”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”BMW”/>
</xs:restriction>
</xs:simpleType>
</xs:element>

So, for example, maybe we could have a schema doc with the following:

... lenni.xsd
<!-- ... -->
<xs:element name=”interest”>
<xs:simpleType>
<xs:restriction base=”xs:string”>
<xs:enumeration value=”Aquazone”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Bionicle”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”CAD”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Castle”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Mecha”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Mosaic”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Pirate”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Robotics”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Space”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Star Wars”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Technic”/>
<xs:enumeration value=”Train”/>
</xs:restriction>
</xs:simpleType>
</xs:element>

(Note: I’m still picking up XSD syntax so the above might not be exactly correct.)

...somefeed.xml
<?xml version=”1.0”?>
<rss version=”2.0” xmlns:lenni=”http://www.anagrafyxx.com/LENNI/”
xmlns:xsi=”http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance”
xsi:schemaLocation=”http://www.anagrafyxx.com/LENNI/lenni.xsd”>
<!-- ... -->
<item>
<title>This is my Sample</title>
<link>http://www.anagrafyxx.com/LENNI/sample.php</link>
<lenni:filter>News</lenni:filter>
<lenni:interest>Bionicle</lenni:interest>
<lenni:interest>SNOT</lenni:interest>
<lenni:audience>FOL</lenni:audience>
</item>
... and so on.

Now, this doesn’t actually physically restrict anybody from putting “Galidor” in their feed, even if it isn’t in the xs:enumeration list. It just means that if somebody tries to validate that feed, it would not validate. But maybe that’s enough.


Another way of doing this is a “roll-your-own” method, since I haven’t found anything else. It would make software development a bit easier, I think, although I’m surprised that I couldn’t find anything like this after searching for a couple of hours.

Here’s the idea: create a second standalone XML doc, not RSS, which is a definition of the permissible values for the “interest” element. It could look like standard XML:

... interestlist.xml
< ? xml version=”1.0”?>
<interest_def>
<interest_choice>Aquazone</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Bionicle</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>CAD</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Castle</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Clikit</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Dacta</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Duplo</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Harry Potter</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Mecha</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Micro</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Model Team</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Mosaic</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Pirate</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Robotics</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Sculpture</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>SNOT</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Space</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Star Wars</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Technic</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Town</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Train</interest_choice>
<interest_choice>Western</interest_choice>
</interest>

This would basically act as a plugin to software that would suck in the XML file and use it for parsing. It’s really just metadata, but the nice thing is it would remove hardcoding from software sources when interest lists were updated.

The bad thing, of course, is requiring an external function, relying on a file that might or might not be available in the future. The whole thing about LENNI as a “spec” is that it should not require external resources, so although this would be way cool, it’s also sort of a compromise to the independence of the project as a whole. Of course, software developers could just use this XML as a reference source and have their own local copy, and check the list at regular intervals for updates, which would be preferred. So maybe I’m just being uppity.

Now, those are just a couple of ways of dealing with creating a pulldown list. The way I see it working is two ways: content generators (that write out the XML) would have a <select> list presented, with the above listing (or some variation thereof) as the choices. The select would be a multiple selection box, like:

<select name=”interest” multiple=”yes” size=10>
<option>...</option>
</select>

For the content consumers, aka “aggregators”, there’d need to be something like a preferences area where you can select which ones you’d want. I’d also recommend software developers code in an update alert when the list is updated, so people can re-examine their settings. It would also have Audience and Geography in the prefs (as well as obviously in the XML generators).

I hope this makes sense, and that I’m not complicating it unnecessarily. Any other potential solutions?

Thanks,
Kelly



Message has 1 Reply:
  Re: Another LENNI Question (geek alert)
 
(...) I like this solution. The schema can be used not only for validation, but can be pulled to get the list of possible values. Quick question though - can't the list of allowed values be specified in the DTD, which we're going to maintain anyway? (...) (20 years ago, 11-Sep-04, to lugnet.publish, lugnet.general, lugnet.off-topic.geek)

4 Messages in This Thread:

Entire Thread on One Page:
Nested:  All | Brief | Compact | Dots
Linear:  All | Brief | Compact
    

Custom Search

©2005 LUGNET. All rights reserved. - hosted by steinbruch.info GbR