Subject:
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Re: An armed society...
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 28 Jan 2002 21:31:41 GMT
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Viewed:
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2025 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Lindsay Frederick Braun writes:
> > So is "developing world." In fact, most people's conditions are becoming
> > worse instead of better--and following a Western prescription for proper
> > development is the crux of the problem.
>
> I agree.
>
> > But I would argue that there is
> > only a correlative (and self-perpetuating) relationship between the Cold
> > War and the problem of global poverty, not a causative one.
>
> A simple question then: Did the cold war encourage poverty and war in (say)
> Africa?
What do you mean exactly with "encourage"?
IMO, the conditions for the present overabundance of conflicts in Africa has
more to do with the Berlin Conference than it has to do with the Cold War.
This period only enhanced pre-existing rivalries to the point of open
conflict, so I must agree with LFB on this.
> > And how is "cold" a misnomer, given the term's referent?
>
> Cold war : A state of rivalry and tension between two factions, groups, or
> individuals that stops short of open, violent confrontation.
>
> How many Americans died in the cold war? How many died in proxy battles
> across the globe?
Let's see: Korea and perhaps Vietnam are the most obvious, but we can argue
about all the "not so spoken" involvment in SE Asia, Africa and Latin
America. Overall, a great number of lives were lost in "non-frontal"
conflicts, both from USA and USSR, as well as other minor states.
If we count all the figures, it is likely that more Americans have lost
their lives during the cold war than Soviet citizens, as a direct result of
these subsidiary wars. Of course, the greatest number of casualties must
have been suffered by civilians living "between the lines of ideology".
But the expression is used referring to the two Great Powers alone, and in
fact they never reached the point of open conflict *with each other*. No GIs
fought in Afghanistan in the eighties AFAIK, and no "Ivans" fought in
Vietnam under the flag of the USSR (counting "counselors" and "advisors" in
the ranks of those they are advising, and not counting CIA and KGB at all).
We can have subsidiary wars from one major conflict, separated in everything
but the prime cause.
The term seems therefore adequate to me. Besides, we can even see some irony
in it, since the greatest "non-battlefield" of this war was the Artic... ;-)
Pedro
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: An armed society...
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| (...) And I'm not sure that the Cold War encouraged poverty and war in most of Africa, though it may have informed or triggered specific points of instability (a la Nasser). But I don't think the presence of that particular arrangement of world (...) (23 years ago, 29-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: An armed society...
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| (...) So the support we gave to tin-pot dictators around the world just because they were willing to fight local communists had no real outcome? (...) We shall have to disagree. "Cold" infers not battle took place - hundreds of thousands (millions) (...) (23 years ago, 29-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: An armed society...
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| (...) I agree. (...) A simple question then: Did the cold war encourage poverty and war in (say) Africa? (...) Cold war : A state of rivalry and tension between two factions, groups, or individuals that stops short of open, violent confrontation. (...) (23 years ago, 28-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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